Archive for December, 2006

Barbary Pirates Torture of Christians and Jews

December 23, 2006

Pictures of Barbary Pirates tortures of European Christians and Jews.

also hereSearch Barbary Pirates torture. First hit is pictures from British Library of torture by Barbary Pirates. These pictures are from 1637. The torture continued for 200 more years. All the time those against it were called Islamophobic, not.

Over 1 million Europeans, Christians and Jews, were taken by the Barbary Pirates up to the 1800’s.

When the US asked them why, they said God commands them to.

My security code is sound. As you look at the pictures, think of the sounds the people made. The Muslim torturers wanted to hear that. Why?

Because they wanted non-Muslims to fear Muslims. They want Islamophobia, its in the Koran. God commands non-Muslims to be Islamophobes.

Posted by: Old Atlantic

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002227.php

search Barbary Pirates torture

Reference —

Record Number: nhil 021 0001349
Shelfmark: C.80.a.2
Page Folio Number: 412 – 413
Description: Scenes of torture, carried out by the Barbary pirates or Corsairs. Twenty-two scenes.
Title of Work: Histoire de Barbarie, et des Corsaires…
Author: Pierre, Dan
Illustrator:
Production: Pierre Rocolet, Paris, 1637
Language/Script: French / –
All efforts have been made to ensure the accuracy of the information contained in the above description, but the British Library cannot accept responsibility for any errors that may occur.

http://www.imagesonline.bl.uk/britishlibrary/controller/subjectidsearch?id=8126&&idx=1&startid=2051

Barbary Pirates at Vdare (they have a fund raising drive and are short of money on it.)
Peter Brimelow, “Are Mexican Immigrants The New Barbary Pirates?”.

Barbary Pirates site:Vdare.com

http://books.guardian.co.uk/news/articles/0,6109,1166849,00.html

His (Robert Davis) new book, Christian Slaves, Muslim Masters: White Slavery in the Mediterranean, the Barbary Coast, and Italy, 1500-1800, concluded that 1 million to 1.25 million ended up in bondage.

See “New book reopens old arguments about slave raids on Europe” “US scholar claims more than 1m people were captured by African pirates”

Rory Carroll, Africa correspondent
Thursday March 11, 2004
The Guardian
Modern Tribalist

Cartoon Jihad cover of Weekly Standard

Those who deny the origin or cause of genocide or mass slavery are a type of genocide denier. Denying that Muhammed and the Koran commanded this genocide and slavery is genocide denial. Denying that the Koran and Muhammed are part of Islam, and that Islam commanded this genocide is genocide denial. Its the same as denying Hitler and Mein Kampf were part of the Holocaust in World War II.

This article is hypotheses, speculation or opinion.  This is draft and preliminary. All other disclaimers apply.

Khobar Towers Iran: From Conspiracy Theory to Fact

December 23, 2006

http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/014522.php

(from Jihad Watch) By Carol D. Leonnig in the Washington Post, with thanks to Davida:

A federal judge ruled yesterday that Iran is responsible for the 1996 Khobar Towers bombing and ordered that the government pay $254 million to the families of 17 Americans who died in the attack in Saudi Arabia.

Comment

search “Khobar Towers” “conspiracy theory”

9,730 hits

“Khobar Towers” “anti-Muslim”

601 hits

“Khobar Towers” bigots

9,140 hits

So this goes, in the MSM, from an anti-Muslim bigot Conspiracy Theory to fact in one day. Moreover, it turns out the government knew this all along.

Imagine what would happen if the MSM read the Koran before telling us what it says. Or read Jihad Watch.

1992 Democrat Coalition calls Virgil Goode Bigot

December 22, 2006

On 9-11, as the smoke rose up, the MSM started calling those who had or might call on stopping immigration bigots. Why? Because Pat Buchanan said stop immigration in 1992 and they called him a bigot as an election ploy to get Clinton elected. They did the same in 1996 and in 2000 for Gore.

Those who were for immigration after the WTC 1993 attacks and before the WTC and Pentagon 2001 attacks know they can’t come out and directly call the 9-11 families, bigots. But they want to make the 9-11 families afraid to speak up too much to stop immigration.

So instead of calling the 9-11 families bigots, they call Virgil Goode a bigot. Or they might call Pat Buchanan or Lou Dobbs bigots. Paul Begala called Virgil Goode a bigot to frighten Bay Bucahan from telling that Begala was part of the 1992 Clinton election team that played with American lives by calling Buchanan a bigot. They won the 1992 election and on 9-11, almost 3000 people died from the immigration that Begala and Clinton said Buchanan was a bigot to want to stop.

Now we are going to hear everyone who was part of the 1992 coalition to elect Clinton call Virgil Goode a bigot. Why? Because they all have 9-11 guilt.

9-11 was a Muslim act of mass murder on Christians and Jews on American soil. Those who get fund raising from these sources, or want their votes have to call the truth tellers like Virgil Goode bigots to keep their supporters, donors, or voters from asking questions.

My security code is square.

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002217.php

==

“Surely, on this holiday eve, there is one Republican who wants to speak publicly for goodwill towards others, even if they’re Muslim.”

Surely, on this holiday eve, there is one Democrat who wants to speak publicly for goodwill towards others, even if they tell the truth about 9-11, the hijackers shouldn’t have been here, we should have stopped immigration after:

WTC 1993 Attack

1996 Bojinka Plot

1998 Embassy bombings

1998 bin Laden Fatwa

2000 Cole Attack

Aug 6 2001 PDB

9-11 2001

My security code is mine.

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002219.php

==

Good post Frog Daddy.

Some think the flying imams are meant to test our security and to make us give it up, and even make it illegal. Some think this or other incidents were a dry run.

Before 9-11, the schools where the hijackers trained were afraid to be called bigots if they turned them in. Some did anyhow, but the FBI had the same problem, especially at the top.

“hopefully we won’t learn the hard way.” that those who call us bigots were against us in the first place.

Those who call our champions bigots were against us in the first place.

Those who call truth tellers bigots were against us in the first place, and this is the truth they don’t want told the most.

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002219.php

==

quote

I for one am sick of your racist crap, Old Atlantic. Would you suggest deporting everyone who came? Since when? Ellison dates his roots to the 18th century, is that far enough back for you? And Merry Christmas.
Posted by: global citizen

end quote

Virgil Goode brought up the issue of stopping immigration. Why do you conflate stopping immigration with deporting? Because to stop it is to admit it was wrong. That is why you switch from stopping immigration to deporting. In your heart, you know they shouldn’t have been allowed in.

Crying bigot is the last refuge of those who are wrong.

My security code is shoe. We have to take off our shoes because of the shoe bomber, who was, gasp, Muslim. He thought he was acting on the basis of Islam, and Islamic courts world wide tend to support that view. We have to decide if we want to stop things getting worse before America is Lebanon or wait until its Iraq.

How tired of racism will you be when America is in civil war like France already is? The racism that shoots you, bombs you, shoe bombs you, takes you hostage, asks for ransom, doesn’t let you put Cartoons where you want, is the real bigotry. They wrote it down in a book, its called the Koran. It means what it says. Muslims believe in the Koran, not you.
http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002219.php

==

The Koran is written as war propaganda. It was written in 656 AD. It commands Muslims to fight non-Muslims and conquer the world. That’s what it says.

Religious courts in Islamic countries come to similar rulings on stoning and lashing women, etc.

Muslims believe in the Koran as written by God, every word. In every Muslim land, Christians, Jews, Hindus, etc. have been forced out or killed. That is going on today in Lebanon and Bethlehem.

Muslims don’t believe in you, they believe in the Koran. Muslims believe in Islam, its not what you believe in.

Liberals have 9-11 guilt. If they stop immigration now, they admit it was wrong after the WTC 93 attacks. They have to admit Pat Buchanan was right in 1992.

Liberals hate their victims, and they can’t admit the truth, which is what stopping immigration is, an admission of truth.

My security code is loss.

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002219.php

==

bin Laden’s 1998 Fatwa:

begin quote

Nothing is more sacred than belief except repulsing an enemy who is attacking religion and life.”

On that basis, and in compliance with Allah’s order, we issue the following fatwa to all Muslims: The ruling to kill the Americans and their allies — civilians and military — is an individual duty for every Muslim who can do it in any country in which it is possible to do it,

end quote

Islam as a unitary entity, religious-political-military attacked the Christian Jewish Western Superpower in 633 AD. The Koran was written in 656 AD from recollections of warriors. It was written down starting in 633 AD because some Muslim holy warriors died in the 633 AD battle of Yamama initiated by Islam as a unitary entity against the Eastern Roman Empire, the Western superpower.

bin Laden’s fatwa is the same thing. His attack on 2001 is the same thing. We responded by sending armies to Afghanistan and then Iraq. It makes no sense to send armies there and not stop their immigration here. We stopped immigration after Pearl Harbor.

What’s the difference? 9-11 was an attack from within by immigrants, so to stop immigration now is an admission that Pat Buchanan was right in 1992 to want to stop immigration.

My security code is profit.

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002219.php

===

Bethlehem 85 percent Christian 1948, 12 percent 2006. There is violence against Christians in Bethlehem today, which is done by Muslims.

Most Muslims want Sharia law in Palestine. University of Jordan did a survey of views in Palestine and other Muslim lands, and most Muslims i all those countries want Sharia law as a source or the sole source of law.

Christians in Morocco are persecuted. Its in every Muslim country.

Americans were taking hostage by North African countries c. 1800, c. 1900, and have been taken hostage or attacked multiple times by other Muslim countries. From 1500 to the French occupation in the 19th century, North Africa took over 1 million Christians slaves in raiding parties on the seas, Europe and North America.

One act of kindness or even many doesn’t make up for an eventual genocide or forcing out. Muslims want Sharia law, they want Islam, that’s why they are Muslims.

Real bigots are liberals who say that Muslims believe what they believe in.

Letting Muslims in the West has corresponded to persecution of Christians and Jews and Hindus in Muslim lands. It makes them think they are winning. Qaddafi said in 50 years Europe will be Muslim. Ergo, Muslims don’t have to change, i.e. become liberals.

Muslims aren’t liberals. You hate Protestants so much, you can’t see that. They take your comments as the sign of weakness.

Also your argument on sign of weakness doesn’t make sense. If they thought like you do, they would stop persecuting Muslims, Christians, Hindus, Jews, etc. in their lands, which they don’t.

My security code is brain.

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002219.php

==

Cousin X,

Bad acts by others don’t make it desirable to have bad acts inflicted on us. All the bad acts in history by Christians, Jews, Hindus, etc. won’t make me want to be a victim of Muslim violence.

==
You are a very sad, ignorant, man.
Use your security code.
Posted by: ENZA

Can you be more specific? How ignorant? Why do you want Muslim immigration? What benefit does it have? Immigration has a substitution effect, all immigation does. This makes it undesirable, period.

My security code is wind, as in Wind and the Lion, when Americans were held hostage in Morocco, c. 1900.

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002219.php

==

sami, I agree with many of your comments, but the issue is continued Muslim immigration. I believe all immigration should stop, with no amnesties or guest worker.

It isn’t beating on immigrants to stop future immigration. This is one of the logical fallacies that permeates the pro immigration arguments.

Sustained immigration causes genetic survival ratios to asymptote to zero. Search on “Unpleasant Immigration Arithmetic”. Thus its irrational. This is true for each annual cohort of immigrants, not just those here.

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002219.php

==

“And all the bad acts in history by Muslims won’t make me want to be a victim of Fundamentalist / Right Wing violence.”

The only fundamentlist violence going on is that being done by Muslims in the US, France, UK, Lebanon, Turkey, Saudi Arabia, Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Sudan, etc.

==

Realist, I agree with your remarks up to your final sentence. See link on this post for comments on Saudi Arabia and Pakistan.

BTW Complete 9-11 Timeline needs money and is exposing Bush links to Saudi Arabia and Pakistan.  They have a matching grant but are behind in meeting it.

My security code is judge.

Paul Begala should apologize to Bay Buchanan, Pat and Virgil Goode

December 21, 2006

It isn’t right for people on TV to call Goode a bigot or ask others to while Danish Cartoonists are in hiding and CNN won’t put the Danish Cartoons on its webpage.

Only those who have spoken out for Rushdie, the Danish Cartoonists, and all the rest in hiding have the moral right to call Goode a bigot.

Its wrong to put people on TV on the spot to denounce Goode’s comments when the same TV people or their station is afraid of Muslim death threats.

This happened to Bay Buchanan on CNN with Begala and Wolf Blitzer.

Begala was in the Clinton administration. Clinton let the 19 hijackers in.

The schools where they trained were in some cases afraid to turn in the hijackers for fear of being called bigot.

After 9-11, Bush and Mineta praised Islam and said no profiling. But secretly they knew they had been given warnings. They used the bigot charge to keep people from asking questions.

Begala and the Clinton team let in the 19 hijackers. They called Pat Buchanan a bigot in 1996 for wanting to stop the immigration.

Its wrong for Begala to be part of the Clinton team that let in the hijackers, let them train at schools, ignored the warnings, called Pat Buchanan names, and then pressure his sister on CNN to denounce Goode.

Begala should apologize for calling Pat Buchanan a bigot in 1996 when Pat wanted to stop immigration. Begala did the same thing as Mineta and Bush after 9-11, to cover up his own guilt for calling Pat Buchanan a bigot in 1996, he threatened his sister Bay with the same thing if she wanted to stop immigration.

How many times must we be attacked and have the people like Begala responsible for letting them in get away with calling Pat Buchanan a bigot for wanting to stop them?

Why is Begala a moral person for letting the 19 hijackers in, but Pat Buchanan is a bigot for warning to keep them out?

This is the same cover up scheme that Mineta, Bush, C. Rice, Peter Jennings, Clinton, Begala, etc. said after 9-11 and on the day of 9-11. The smoke was rising up as they started calling people who wanted to stop immigration bigots.

The 9-11 families were the targets of the MSM on 9-11. The President in his Religion of Peace speech was threatening to call the 9-11 families bigots if they asked for Muslim immigration to stop.

This is so 1938 its unbelievable.

Begala should apologize to the 9-11 families for failing them like Richard Clarke did. Begala shouldn’t call anyone a bigot while he has this guilt. Begala should apologize to Pat Buchanan for Buchanan being called a bigot in 1996. The Clinton team did that deliberately in 1996. They traded almost 3000 lives on 9-11 to win re-election in 1996. They need to apologize to the 9-11 families for that election and for calling Pat Buchanan a bigot in 1996.

CNN should apologize to Bay Buchanan, the 9-11 families, the Danish Cartoonists and the American people for how they have covered this issue from 1993 to present.

==The Paul Begala incident on the Wolf Blitzer show
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0612/21/sitroom.01.html

PAUL BEGALA, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: You know, well, first, just call a spade a spade. Virgil Goode is a bigot and he’s an idiot. Let’s hope he clears that up when he has his press conference, because lots of people misspeak.

BLITZER: Let me read once again for you, Bay, and for our viewers precisely what is in this letter that he wrote: “If American citizens don’t wake up and adopt the Virgil Goode position on immigration, there will likely be many more Muslims elected to office and demanding the use of the Koran.”

(You have to see the video to see how she was put on the spot throughout this question and the subsequent discussion.)

BAY BUCHANAN, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: I can understand what he is trying to say. I think that his choice of words were outrageous. I think it’s a clear mistake that he made, to suggest that we should be worried that Keith Ellison is a — happens to be a Muslim, and is elected now to the Congress, wants to use a Koran.

I don’t see any problem with any of the above, none whatsoever. I think what he — what he is trying to say, which I think is a legitimate point, is that, as a nation, we should get control of our immigration laws, and make certain we have a national debate as to what is our best interests as to who is coming and who we are inviting into this country.

And that is a legitimate national debate, not what we’re doing today. But I think this is something not quite that. And I think this is a mistake.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0612/21/sitroom.01.html

When she says “This is a mistake” she means what is being done to her. This is the main clue from the transcript of just how much she felt set up and put in a position by Begala.

And, yes, Virginia, it was a mistake, for Begala to do this, possibly planned out in advance, knowing Bay Buchanan would feel vulnerable because Pat Buchanan was attacked the same way as Virgil Goode was just then by Paul Begala during the 1996 Clinton Dole campaign. It was a mistake for Wolf Blitzer to let it happen. This isn’t the first time Begala and Blitzer have been on TV or been through one of these.

Then they talked about Sandy Berger. Was Begala trying to so upset Bay Buchanan that Begala could skate the truth about the new information about the Berger incident with Bay Buchanan so shaken up she couldn’t nail him on it?

Is there still a cover up going on by the Clinton administration about anything that happened between Jan 20, 1993 and Jan 20,2001?

==

No TV network, no newspaper, no blog page has a moral right to call Goode or Pat Buchanan bigots unless it has defended the Danish Cartoonists, and all the others and apologize to the 9-11 families for letting PC let the 19 hijackers in legally after the WTC 1993 attack and bin Laden’s declaration of war.

They must say to the families that they failed them when they called Pat Buchanan a bigot in 1996 and on the day of 9-11 by continuing that.

President Bush must apologize for the religion of peace speech when he knew he had the warnings on August 6, 2001 and was covering that up. He and all the others in the Clinton and Bush administration must apologize for letting PC prevent stopping the 9-11 attacks.

They must also apologize to the Danish Cartoonists and everyone in hiding since their earlier failures.

They must apologize, all of them, to future victims. Whenever they issue a warning, they should issue an apology for letting PC prevent saving the lives of Americans on 9-11.

http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/014508.php

==How to answer Begala, Blitzer, etc.

If you are on TV and you are asked to denounce someone or some idea, ask to see the 12 Danish Cartoons on their web page first and to show them right then on the TV before you answer.

Show all the Danish Cartoons before asking me that question and put them all on your web page, and then I will answer.

They will say, what’s that got to do with this?

Everything.

==Was Paul Begala lying in wait for Bay Buchanan?

Did Paul Begala intentionally do what he did to Bay Buchanan?

He is an experienced campaign operative and strategist. He coaches people on what to do in these situations. Wasn’t this deliberate?

Wasn’t Paul Begala intentionally covering up for the Clinton administration 9-11 guilt?

Wasn’t he intentionally doing what Peter Jennings, Norman Mineta, and George Bush did on and after 9-11?

Isn’t it all the same? Isn’t it all true?

At last sir, have you no decency?

Does the Clinton team have no decency?

Didn’t the Clinton team choose to cover up and lie about sex, FBI files, travelgate, IMF loans to Russia, Wall Street trading Russian government bonds, Paula Jones IRS audit, Judicial Watch IRS audit, IRS audits of the other Clinton women, the 1990’s stock market bubble, Saudi Arabia funding terrorism, Pakistan’s nuclear program, Chinese influence, and all the rest instead of stopping immigration after the WTC 1993 attack, the August 1998 embassy bombings, the USS Cole attack in 2000, bin Laden’s declaration of war in 1998 and all the other classified information they have never disclosed?

The MSM, Bush team, Democrats, Republicans, Congress, Blair, Labour Party, Conservative Party, Lib Dems, profs, think tanks, and all the rest?

==Who should receive an apology:

  1. Virgil Goode
  2. 9-11 Families
  3. American People
  4. Bay Buchanan
  5. Pat Buchanan
  6. Bob Dole
  7. Danish Cartoonists
  8. Rushdie
  9. All others in hiding
  10. All those who had to engage in ritual denunciations from fear of PC or Muslim terrorists.
  11. Future victims of sleeper cells already in the US after the 1993 WTC attack.
  12. Future victims of sleeper cells already in the US after the 1998 embassy bombings attack.
  13. Future victims of sleeper cells already in the US after the 1998 bin Laden declaration of war.
  14. Future victims of sleeper cells already in the US after the August 6, 2001 PDB.
  15. Future victims of sleeper cells already in the US after the 2001 WTC and Pentagon attack.
  16. Future victims of sleeper cells already in the US after each and every event on the Complete 9-11 Timeline started by Paul Thompson and championed by the 9-11 Families. (And they need money, please donate this Dec 2006 they have a 10,000 matching grant.)
  17. Future victims of sleeper cells to enter after today, whatever day today is.

Future Operating Procedures

No network or newspaper like CNN should allow anyone who asks for stopping Muslim immigration to be called a bigot or ask someone to denounce them until they apologize to all the above and post the Danish Cartoons, and show them on TV and publish them in their print edition, whatever is applicable.

==

To avoid the overposting police, I have added to the above

Paul Begala should apologize to Bay Buchanan, Pat and Virgil Goode


Virgil Goode Right: Stop Muslim Immigration

I shall just say whenever one is put on the spot to ritually denounce Goode or anyone else for PC violations, ask the TV station to

(1) First show all 12 Danish Cartoons

(2) Post them on their webpage

And they should show all 12 before you answer.

Bring them with you and ask them to show them on the TV and then post them on their webpage.

Posted by: Old Atlantic [TypeKey Profile Page] at December 21, 2006 08:08 PM

 

http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/014508.php

==What to say to Paul Begala

Ask him to apologize to the 9-11 Famlies for failing them by letting the 19 hijackers immigrate after 9-11.

Ask Begala to apologize to the 9-11 Families for calling Pat Buchanan, or others associated with the Democratic Party or Clinton admin, a bigot when he wanted to stop or limit immigration after the WTC 1993 attacks during the 1996 Clinton Dole Presidential Campaign.

Ask Begala to apologize to Pat Buchanan and his sister for these incidents.

Ask him to apologize to all those in hiding now because of events that happened after the WTC 1993 on the Clinton watch.

Ask him to apologize for all the scandals of the Clinton years that kept them from dealing with the WTC 1993 attacks.

Ask him to apologize for not responding to the WTC 1993 attacks with at least as much action as after the WTC and Pentagon 2001 attacks.

Ask him to apologize for the role of Saudi Arabia and Pakistan being covered up by both the Clinton and Bush teams.

Ask him to apologize for the 1995 Jamie Gorelick Wall Memo.

Ask him to apologize for the joint cover up by Democrats and Republicans, Clinton and Bush of all the things that happened from Jan 20, 1989 to present.

Ask him to apologize for all of the issues raised above.

Ask him if he has, at last, no decency, and when he and the Clinton team and the Democratic Party lost it?

 

Ask for a moment of silence for past and future victims of what they are afraid to name.

And another moment for all its victims around the world today, all those in prison, being tortured, denied legal rights, women denied equality, people in hiding in any country, and all the rest, all of it from something they can’t name and are afraid to name lest they too have to go in hiding or receive death threats, which many can’t afford the body guards for.

Ask for a moment of silence of all the victims of the 1930’s in the Soviet Union when the New York Times would not tell the truth and covered it up.

All the victims of Hitler who could have been saved if the truth and action had been taken sooner.

All the victims of the Muslim genocide of Christians and Jews in the Ottoman Empire and its successor states from 1890 to the present and for not naming what is causing this.

Another moment for all those who almost died in the cold war and might still from letting Russia, China, Pakistan, North Korea, and now it appears Iran get nuclear weapons.

==

“”PC” may have been invented by some misguided liberals, ”

From wiki

begin quote

The contemporary use of the term political correctness is said to derived from Marxist-Leninist vocabulary to describe the Party Line. [1]

The term was transformed and used jokingly within the Left by the early 1980s, possibly earlier. [citation needed] In this context, the phrase was applied to either an over-commitment to various left-wing political causes, especially within Marxism or the feminist movement; or to a tendency by some of those dedicated to these causes to be more concerned with rhetoric and vocabulary than with substance.

end quote

Only those who have stood up for the Danish Cartoonists, and all others in hiding in Western
or Muslim lands for speaking the truth have a moral right to call Goode, Pat Buchanan or anyone else a bigot.

All those in the MSM, or Democratic Party or Clinton Administration who called Pat Buchanan a bigot for saying restrict immigration then in the 1996 Clinton Dole presidential race should apologize to the 9-11 families. They knew on 9-11, that their words had cost the 3000 people their lives.

The MSM, Clinton and Bush teams then pre-emptively used PC language to frighten the 9-11 families from questioning why immigration continued after the WTC 1993 attack by Muslim immigrants. This goes on and we are watching the same techniques used on 9-11 on TV and afterwards against the 9-11 Families on Virgil Goode.

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002215.php

==

Good bumper sticker Caroline. That’s what Virgi Goode or Bay Buchanan should say next time they get accosted by the MSM apology police.

Its interesting that the Saudi Religious Police, Paul Begala, and the MSM police all want Virgil Goode and Bay Buchanan to say the same thing.

I wonder if Virgil Goode’s two names have something to do with his deciding to stand up for truth and Americans.

Posted by: Old Atlantic [TypeKey Profile Page] at December 21, 2006 10:21 PM

 

 

The next time Bay Buchanan is on Wolf Blitzer with Begala and they ask her to apologize and ritually denounce Goode, she should say, do you guys work for the Saudi Religious Police?

 

http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/014506.php

==

CNN should have had Robert Spencer instead of Bay Buchanan to be the opposite view to Paul Begala.

They chose Bay Buchanan because she doesn’t know enough about Islam and all the history to answer PC loaded, surrender or be called a bigot questions. To stand up to those you need an enormous amount of knowledge.

They chose her as their victim intentionally.

The answer to PC is knowledge. But you have to have a lot of knowledge to be able to use it on the spot on TV with the sickle of being denounced as a bigot hanging over your head.

Begala preps people for TV and debate. He knows what it is. He knew what he was doing.

Posted by: Old Atlantic [TypeKey Profile Page] at December 21, 2006 10:32 PM

 

http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/014508.php

Standing up to PC loaded questions to denounce someone takes the specialized knowledge and daily practice in Islam and current events involving it of a Robert Spencer. Its like surgery or litigation. You need someone who does it every day.

Begala knew that. That’s why he picked on Bay Buchanan. He had choreographed that denunciation of Virgil Goode the way a football coach scripts out the first plays of a football game. In fact, he did it like a Paul Begala scrips out a gotcha gimmick in a political debate.

 

 

This article represents hypotheses, speculation or opinion. It is draft and preliminary. All other disclaimers apply.

Virgil Goode Right: Stop Muslim Immigration

December 20, 2006

We must stop Muslim immigration to save Western civilization and ultimately our own lives. Political Correctness about Islam or Muslims is lethal.

Why is it moral to bomb people in Iraq but not moral to stop them coming here to kill us? They can’t come here and kill us if they can’t come here. Why is it moral to bomb people in Iraq but not moral to keep the same people coming here as immigrants?

There should be no immigration in time of war. Virgil Goode is right. Stop immigration. This is where we decide whether to win this war or not.

Many people, who disagree with Goode, and many who agree with him will feel they must call me or others on my side bigot. People should feel free to take back those words or move on from them to the substance of the debate.
If people are overcome by PC, that should be ignored as well. Everyone should feel free to revise and extend their remarks because they felt overcome by PC. Its a daily experience we all feel, called fear.

PC-pecking, A method by which all Liberals keep all people in a state of fear. (paraphrase from Firing Line debate many years back on henpecking.)

Surgeons have what the call bleed time. This is a period of time after the first incision. In our PC drenched culture, the equivalent is bigot calling time. This is an initial period when a liberal, or a PC fearful conservative, has to call others bigot, even if they agree with them.

When asked as a ritual to call others bigot, point it out. I decline to call Virgil Goode a bigot. Like Reagen, can turn it around and say, I decline to call my opponent mean spirted or lacking in courtesy.

This debate should be had in good humor. The excesses of rhetoric on both sides should be regarded as good clean fun. We must, in time of war, hold ourselves to the consequences of our choices, not to the high spirits of the debate. We must all live together with the deaths of our people that will continue in this war, both here and there.
Over 3,000 people were killed in the terrorist incidents up to and including 9-11. More have died since then here and there. We owe this debate our best arguments. If that requires use of rhetoric on either side that is a little heavy going, we should respond on the basis of substance. It also allows people to take back what they said or move on, and always to focus on the substance and the consequences.

All remarks here or elsewhere by me should be understod to be revised in that way. There are so many remarks calling this author a bigot that it would be impossible to keep track of them all or even a portion.
This post is draft and preliminary and represents some notes on posts made at various sites. This post will be cleaned up and revised as time permits.

==

December 20th, 2006 at 10:18:21 From: Fallaci Admirer

bin Laden’s Fatwa: Kill Americans
“We — with God’s help — call on every Muslim who believes in God and wishes to be rewarded to comply with God’s order to kill the Americans and plunder their money wherever and whenever they find it.”

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/terrorism/international/fatwa_1998.html

They believe the Koran commans them to kill every American. “On that basis, and in compliance with God’s order, we issue the following fatwa to all Muslims: The ruling to kill the Americans and their allies — civilians and military — is an individual duty for every Muslim who can do it in any country in which it is possible to do it”

http://www.rawstory.com/comments/24293.html

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/terrorism/international/fatwa_1998.html

==

bin Laden’s Fatwa: Kill Americans

“We — with God’s help — call on every Muslim who believes in God and wishes to be rewarded to comply with God’s order to kill the Americans and plunder their money wherever and whenever they find it.”

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/terrorism/international/fatwa_1998.html bin Laden Fatwa 1998

They believe the Koran commands “every Muslim to kill the Americans, civilians and military”.

“On that basis, and in compliance with God’s order, we issue the following fatwa to all Muslims: The ruling to kill the Americans and their allies — civilians and military — is an individual duty for every Muslim who can do it in any country in which it is possible to do it”

And in August 1998, embassies, Cole 2000, WTC 2001 and Pentagon 2001, etc. they did it according to this Fatwa. 9-11 was done by legal immigrants who came after the WTC 1993 attack.

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002189.php

==

THE INTERNATIONAL
LESBIAN AND GAY ASSOCIATION

“1. Sources

The primary source for Islamic Law is the Koran. The second element is known as the Sunna, these being the teachings of the Prophet Mohammed and his oldest disciples not explicitly found in the Koran. The third element of Shari’a Law is known as the Ijma. These are rules developed on the basis of debate and subsequent consensus among religious scholars and the Moslem community as a whole. When these three main sources fail to provide adequate guidance, they are supplemented by a system in which the jurist can draw parallels with the first three sources (the Qiyas). Finally, there are several other methods for developing judgements, each of which allows increased use of discretion by the jurist. These latter sources allow for the development of Shari’a Law in more liberal jurisdictions, but are rejected in more conservative jurisdictions.”

“In the Hadith, homosexual behaviour is condemned harshly: “whenever a male mount another male, the throne of God trembles”……… if you see two people who act like the people of Lot, then kill the active and the passive”.”

“Legal Sanctions
The punishment that the Islamic jurists generally prescribe for adultery, and therefore also for homosexual behaviour, is stoning to death for married people, and 100 lashes for unmarried people…”


Gays flee Iraq as Shia death squads find a new target” Jennifer Copestake Guardian August 6, 2006.

http://observer.guardian.co.uk/world/story/0,,1838222,00.html

http://www.ilga.info/Information/Legal_survey/middle%20east/supporting%20files/sharia_law.htm

Sharia Koran

http://www.google.com/search?q=Sharia+Koran&sourceid=mozilla-search&start=0&start=0&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official

http://www.omdurman.org/sharia.html

==

http://www.omdurman.org/sharia.html


Saudi Religious Police burn schoolgirls to death for being improperly dressed Saudi police ‘stopped’ fire rescue
Saudi Arabia’s religious police stopped schoolgirls from leaving a blazing building because they were not wearing correct Islamic dress, according to Saudi newspapers.”

“TEHRAN (Reuters) – An Iranian man cut off his seven- year-old daughter’s head after suspecting she had been raped by her uncle, the Jomhuri-ye Eslami newspaper said on Sunday.
…”The motive behind the killing was to defend my honor, fame, and dignity,” the paper quoted the father as saying. (Source)”

“Judicial Rape in Iran and the Sudan
Women, Islam & Equality describes Iran’s version of the “Muslim” religion:

According to a “religious” decree, virgin women prisoners must as a rule be raped before their execution, “lest they go to Paradise.””

==

” It (US) also leads in murders and other violent felonies.”

Search

murder site:Vdare.com

crime immigration site:Vdare.com

crime immigration site:Amren.com

Borjas black site:Vdare.com

“The employment rate of black men in the United States fell precipitously from 89.6 percent in 1960 to 76.1 percent in 2000… The decline in labor market participation among black men was accompanied by a rapid increase in the number of black men in correctional institutions. As recently as 1980, only 0.8 percent of black men … were incarcerated. By 2000, 9.6 percent of black men … were incarcerated.”

From Steve Sailer

http://www.vdare.com/sailer/060924_crime.htm

==

December 20th, 2006 at 11:27:11 From: Fallaci Admirer
“UK: Police killer escapes in veil”
http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/014490.php

http://www.rawstory.com/comments/24311.html

==

http://islamstrueface.blogspot.com/2005/07/muslim-atrocities.html

“All other religions, despite their bloody past are now only concerned with personal piety and spiritual development of their followers. Some of them also get involved in works of charity like Salvation Army, Habitat for Humanity, etc. But Muslims are the only group that still thinks of Jihad, and expansion of their religion through violent means. Muslims are the only group that believes their god has given them the mission to kill those who reject him. Muslims are the only group that still endeavors to impose the antiquated misogynistic laws of their “holy” book. And Muslims are the only group that has not apologized for the crimes of their past and keeps committing those crimes even today.”

“I am a former muslim convert, and the religion of Islam fascinated me. Being the pacifist i was, i was drawn to the “religion of peace.” Until i discovered the truth about the religion, and my purpose is to share it with you I intend by all means neccesary to remain anonymous, for death is the punishment for apostates and those who speak ill of Islam. Contact me at: kaffirtruthseeker@hotmail.com”

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002187.php

Muslim atrocities

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&hs=0mO&sa=X&oi=spell&resnum=0&ct=result&cd=1&q=Muslim+atrocities&spell=1

http://biblia.com/islam/islam.htm

==

December 20th, 2006 at 11:55:50 From: Fallaci Admirer
MSM bemoans defeat
What is new and interesting in this op-ed blog? The MSM don’t like being confronted with fact. Men’s median wages are lower today than in 1973. This is caused by immigration that Wall Street Journal pushes. Black men’s incarceration rates are up from before the 1965 Immigration Act to today by an increase in a factor of ten, from less then 1 percent to about 9 percent. The percentage employed drop by a similar figure. Its this fact, the WSJ doesn’t want pushed back at it. See

http://www.vdare.com/sailer/060924_crime.htm

“The employment rate of black men in the United States fell precipitously from 89.6 percent in 1960 to 76.1 percent in 2000… The decline in labor market participation among black men was accompanied by a rapid increase in the number of black men in correctional institutions. As recently as 1980, only 0.8 percent of black men … were incarcerated. By 2000, 9.6 percent of black men … were incarcerated.” by Steve Sailer. WSJ doesn’t want this feedback instantly.

http://www.rawstory.com/comments/24321.html

==

“Spencer’s Truth About Muhammad banned in Pakistan!”

http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/014495.php

==

December 20th, 2006 at 12:44:39 From: Fallaci Admirer
“Ignorance” about Islam, Jihadwatch the cure
“Sixth month in jail for Saudi woman involuntarily divorced from husband by half-brothers”

http://www.jihadwatch.org/dhimmiwatch/archives/014488.php

==

“2006: The Year Of Perpetual Muslim Outrage”

By Michelle Malkin

http://www.vdare.com/malkin/061219_outrage.htm

==

December 20th, 2006 at 12:55:39 From: Fallaci Admirer

Save the soldiers, invade Iran now
They also serve who keep our total deaths lower. Fighting now does that. We lost 6,825 on Iwo Jima, from Wiki. That was one battle. We lost under 200 in the combat phase in Iraq. We could defeat all the main enemy homelands, Iran, Pakistan and Saudi Arabia for less. We paid 3000 occupation phase deaths for the Iraqi bases. We have bases on 3 sides of Iran. Battle phase deaths in Iraq were under 200. Time to fight wars is when battle phase deaths are 200. We will lose millions when they have nukes or more of them come here by immigration and kill us here. They can’t kill us here if we don’t let them come here.

http://www.rawstory.com/comments/24293.html

==

“Only to the same extent it was a “problem” to have a large Catholic immigrant population in a traditionally Protestant one. That is, people like Goode may have a problem with it but who cares?”

<a href=”http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&hs=i0Q&q=%22Christian+genocide%22&btnG=Search”&gt;
Christian genocide” </a>

==

“Only to the same extent it was a “problem” to have a large Catholic immigrant population in a traditionally Protestant one. That is, people like Goode may have a problem with it but who cares?”

<a href=”http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&hs=i0Q&q=%22Christian+genocide%22&btnG=Search”&gt;
Christian genocide” </a>

No Muslim land has not forced out or genocided all the non-Muslims, or isn’t doing it now.

http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/9391.html

http://digg.com/political_opinion/Rep_Virgil_Goode_does_his_part_to_help_spread_Islam#c4353375

==

“No Muslim land has not forced out or genocided all the non-Muslims, or isn’t doing it now.

Unless I really don’t understand the situation in Darfur, your comment is incorrect unless you want to get pendantic and technical in your parsing (i.e. “Muslim land”). ” from Edo

First, a technical response, then a response on Darfur.
Darfur genocide is described by CS Monitor as Arab Muslims on black Muslims as victims. This is not in conflict with the statement “No Muslim land has not forced out … the non-Muslims”, since Darfur as so-described is not part of the subject matter of this statement.

Now as for Darfur.

“Sudan, like most African postcolonial states, is partially a victim of imperial cartography. Thoughtlessly carved out by the British during the 19th-century scramble to claim Africa, Sudan is a forced crucible of Muslim Arabs and black Africans. The blacks in the south either hew to their ancestral traditional African religions or have converted to Christianity. The fact that black Africans in Darfur are exclusively Muslim has not stopped the Arab Janjaweed militias and the government from exterminating them.”

<a href=”http://www.csmonitor.com/2004/0714/p09s02-coop.html”&gt;
CS Monitor on Darfur </a>

Arab Muslims consider blacks, Muslim or not to be not their equals. Arab Muslims for centuries had a slave trade in blacks that involved their not surviving long term.

Basically, the Arabs for over a 1000 years took blacks as slaves and then didn’t breed them as in the old South in the US but instead prevented that by various means. The result of this history is a permanent state of mind of Arabs towards blacks.

This comes from the time when Arabs were Muslim and blacks were not. The same treatment is being applied to the blacks by the Arabs today as in the time that blacks were not Muslim.

Thus the Darfur genocide is inherited from prior genocide by Arab Muslims of blacks for centuries as part of their slave management methods.

==

“No Muslim land has not forced out or genocided all the non-Muslims, or isn’t doing it now.

Unless I really don’t understand the situation in Darfur, your comment is incorrect unless you want to get pendantic and technical in your parsing (i.e. “Muslim land”). ” from Edo

First, a technical response, then a response on Darfur.
Darfur genocide is described by CS Monitor as Arab Muslims on black Muslims as victims. This is not in conflict with the statement “No Muslim land has not forced out … the non-Muslims”, since Darfur as so-described is not part of the subject matter of this statement.

Now as for Darfur.

“Sudan, like most African postcolonial states, is partially a victim of imperial cartography. Thoughtlessly carved out by the British during the 19th-century scramble to claim Africa, Sudan is a forced crucible of Muslim Arabs and black Africans. The blacks in the south either hew to their ancestral traditional African religions or have converted to Christianity. The fact that black Africans in Darfur are exclusively Muslim has not stopped the Arab Janjaweed militias and the government from exterminating them.”

<a href=”http://www.csmonitor.com/2004/0714/p09s02-coop.html”&gt;
CS Monitor on Darfur </a>

Arab Muslims consider blacks, Muslim or not to be not their equals. Arab Muslims for centuries had a slave trade in blacks that involved their not surviving long term.

Basically, the Arabs for over a 1000 years took blacks as slaves and then didn’t breed them as in the old South in the US but instead prevented that by various means. The result of this history is a permanent state of mind of Arabs towards blacks.

This comes from the time when Arabs were Muslim and blacks were not. The same treatment is being applied to the blacks by the Arabs today as in the time that blacks were not Muslim.

Thus the Darfur genocide is inherited from prior genocide by Arab Muslims of blacks for centuries as part of their slave management methods.

See Susan Stephen on <a href=”http://www.faithfreedom.org/Articles/SStephan/islamic_slavery.htm”>Arab Slave Trade </a>

http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/9391.html

==

December 20th, 2006 at 16:06:53 From: Fallaci Admirer
Immigration => Exploitation
Taking contrapositives, no exploitation implies no immigration.

http://www.rawstory.com/comments/24342.html

this is correct.

there can’t be an absence of exploitation unless there
is an absence of immigration.

look at truth table.

Immigration => exploitation

I=> E is true, means following pairs allowed

I E
-I E
-I -E

the pair not allowed is I,-E.

so -E implies -I

http://www.geocities.com/CollegePark/Classroom/9912/easterntrade.html


The survival rate of this process ranged from 1 in 10 to 1 in 30.

http://www.csmonitor.com/2004/0714/p09s02-coop.html

http://www.scaruffi.com/politics/slavetra.html

http://africanhistory.about.com/library/weekly/aa040201a.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darfur_conflict

http://www.csmonitor.com/2004/0714/p09s02-coop.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1998_U.S._embassy_bombings

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dar_es_Salaam

Arabs slaves blacks

http://www.google.com/search?q=Arabs+slaves+blacks&sourceid=mozilla-search&start=0&start=0&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official

http://www.jihadwatch.org/dhimmiwatch/archives/2005/11/009139print.html

http://www.scaruffi.com/politics/slavetra.html

Arab slavery

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_in_Somalia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tanzania#The_Maji_Maji_War

http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=17747

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biafra#Meaning_of_the_word_.22Biafra.22_and_location_of_Biafra

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maji_Maji

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Political_map_of_Somalia_showing_Jowhar.png

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scramble_for_Africa

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Place_in_the_sun

http://www.democrats.com/node/11451

http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/9391.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1998_U.S._embassy_bombings

http://africanhistory.about.com/library/weekly/aa040201a.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tanzania

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zanzibar#Slave_and_ivory_trade

http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=17747

Christians Ottomans

==

“Muslims For A Safe America conducted a survey at the Islamic Society of North America’s 43rd Annual Convention in Chicago from September 1, 2006 to September 4, 2006. 307 Muslims who are American citizens participated in the survey at the Muslims For A Safe America booth at ISNA,” the organization reports. Some respones:

2. Do you consider yourself to be a Muslim first, an American first, or both equally?
MUSLIM FIRST 214
AMERICAN FIRST 4
BOTH EQUALLY 86
UNDECIDED 3

3. Is the American government at war with the religion of Islam?
YES 208
NO 79
UNDECIDED 20

5. Did Muslims hijack planes and fly them into buildings on 9/11?
YES 117
NO 139
UNDECIDED 51

6. Did the U.S. government have advance knowledge of the 9/11 attacks, and allow the attacks to occur?
YES 200
NO 70
UNDECIDED 37
7. Did the U.S. government organize the 9/11 attacks?
YES 106
NO 151
UNDECIDED 50

8. Are the tapes of Osama Bin Laden, claiming responsibility for the 9/11 attacks and threatening future attacks, real or fake?
REAL 126
FAKE 129
UNDECIDED 52

9. Did Muslims commit the July 2005 train and bus bombings in London?
YES 140
NO 104
UNDECIDED 63

21. Should Iran develop nuclear weapons?
YES 161
NO 123
UNDECIDED 23

25. Was America justified in invading Afghanistan after 9/11?
YES 51
NO 248
UNDECIDED 8

The organization notes that “this was NOT a scientific survey, because ISNA Convention attendees who visited the Muslims For A Safe America booth are not necessarily representative of the American Muslim community as a whole.” We really hope so.

Posted by Daniel Freedman at October 26, 2006 11:22 AM

<a href=”http://www.shinesforall.com/archives/2006/10/muslims_for_a_s.html”&gt;
Source </a>

http://www.shinesforall.com/archives/2006/10/muslims_for_a_s.html

=

“Muslim first” “american first”

http://blogsearch.google.com/blogsearch?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&q=%22Muslim+first%22++%22american+first%22&btnG=Search+Blogs

http://www.americanthinker.com/2006/11/will_islam_dominate_the_future.html


The other principal focus of Steyn’s book is on the inability of contemporary multiculturalism to provide a meaningful, vigorous base on which to sustain and defend Western civilization. On the contrary, as Steyn sharply remarks,

‘multiculturalism was conceived by the Western elites not to celebrate all cultures but to deny their own.’

Hence, ‘the governing principle of multicultural society’ is that ‘Western man demonstrates his cultural sensitivity by pre—emptively surrendering.’ This already is happening in Europe, which Steyn thoroughly documents. But it even is happening in the United States — see the craven response by our political and media establishment to last year’s Cartoon Intifada, and the continued refusal by our law enforcement agencies to engage in ‘racial profiling’ as part of a sensible anti—terrorism strategy. Steyn surely is correct that multiculturalism, and its philosophical twin internationalism, cannot provide the ideological meat needed to maintain a healthy body politic.

Airplanes

cameras in toilets.

people will be cleaner too.

http://blog.washingtonpost.com/postglobal/needtoknow/2006/08/historical_parallels_to_todays.html

http://www.amren.com/mtnews/archives/2006/02/poll_reveals_40.php

http://www.swordscrossed.org/node/754 “we are all Hizballah now.”

http://www.americanthinker.com/2006/11/will_islam_dominate_the_future.html

http://www.digitalbrownpajamas.com/digital_brownpajamas/2006/08/index.html


Being a Muslim first is a wholly different thing from being a Christian first.


Being Muslim first brought about the kinds of countries that oppress, enslave, and murder their own people, motivating them by the hundreds of thousands to flee those countries to places like this one, and then criticize it.

Being a Christian first causes me to pray for the conversion of Muslims to engage them where possible in conversation to convince them to believe in Christ and be saved.

Being Muslim first causes them to threaten the infidel with death by the sword, to infiltrate nations in the desire to bring them under Sharia.

http://www.womenswallstreet.com/columns/column.aspx?aid=946&p=1

Operation Bojinka

http://michellemalkin.com/archives/005699.htm

http://hotair.com/archives/2006/06/22/the-great-divide-pew-surveys-muslim-public-opinion/

http://pewglobal.org/reports/display.php?ReportID=253

==
==

“I am laughing at Old Atlantic… I could post just as much stuff from the Bible that makes Christians look like Christianofascists!” from Happy Monkey. These are things happening now and being said now.

They are a continuation of the same things from the past. There is no break point for Islam.

“Have you ever heard of Turkey? A Muslim country to the very core, yet ruled under a civil code of law for the last century?” from Robert.

See URL attached to this post for source and link to NY Times from 1914.

The last century goes back to include 1914.

The Young “secular” Turks were in power in Turkey by 1914. They continued the same genocide of Christians that was going on in the 1890’s. They killed over 1 million Christians.

“From January 13, 1915 New York Times:

“Talaat Bey, the Minister of the Interior, has stated to the Councillor of the Greek Patriarchate that in Turkey henceforth there will be room only for Turks. While he was profuse in assurance to the Greek Minister regarding the cessation of anti- Greek persecutions, no real amelioration of the situation is perceptible.””

http://www.omdurman.org/sharia.html is about things happening now.

9-11 happened in 2001. Did you laugh on that day at those who said to stop Muslim immigration? All 19 hijackers were immigrants from after the WTC 1993 attack. No immigration, no 3000 killed.

What purpose does immigration serve? Men’s median wages are below what they were in 1973? You are programmed to want your own destruction. You are frustrated when someone tells the truth, that is why so many react to Virgil Goode.

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002189.php

http://www.hoffmania.com/blog/2006/12/dennis_prager_j.html#comment-26817138


Sooner or later every Muslim land genocides or forces out non-Muslims. This is going on today in Lebanon, Bethlehem, etc.

Posted by: Old Atlantic | Dec 20, 2006 5:22:17 PM

Countries are the way they are because of the people.

Australia and NZ are different than surrounding countries because of the people.

If they come from those countries, they behave that way. America will become those countries. That is happening with Hispanic immigration.

http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/9391.html

http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/9391.html

29.

Reply to Edo.

The Arab Muslims in Sudan have for centuries exploited blacks, Muslim or not in Sudan. This includes slavery and other bad treatment. You must have somehow misunderstood my comment.

“your claim that all genocides are Christian is just as false”

I think this is the root of your misconception. The issue with Virgil Goode is whether he is right that Muslim immigration is a threat. The proposition that Muslim lands end up genociding non-Muslims goes to that issue. The question is whether have a positive probability to genocide non-Muslims. If so, then allowing their immigration reduces welfare to non-Muslims here. That proves Muslim immigration should not be allowed. That’s the issue.

Muslims have genocided Christians, Jews, Hindus, Zoroastrians, Africans with other beliefs, and others.

Since the Darfur genocide victims are primarily Muslim and the genociders are Muslim, Judaism and Christianity are not directly relevant. However, the Arab Muslims in Sudan get their tendency to genocide blacks in Sudan, even black Muslims, from their history of genocide of non-Muslim blacks in Africa. That is the meaning of the inheritance, i.e. genocide of black Muslims in Sudan is inherited from genocide of blacks.

Think of black as the root, and Muslim as a branch. The branch inherits from the root. In this case its a little more complicated since its a relation from Arab Muslims to blacks, but that relation can inherit as well.

The prior genocide by Arab Muslims of those in the south of Sudan did involve many Christians as victims.

Comment by Old Atlantic — 12/20/2006 @ 8:36 pm
30.

That should have been black as root and black Muslim as the branch.

Comment by Old Atlantic — 12/20/2006 @ 8:38 pm

..

If Muslims discriminate, commit crime, or genocide non-Muslims that is a reason to keep them out.

and if non Muslims do those things to Muslims its a reason to keep the Muslims out.
(to prevent this)

the former is a reason even if the latter is.

..

Liberalism is anti-West and hates West.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/comment/story/0,,1705411,00.html

http://www.islamophobia-watch.com/islamophobia-watch/2006/10/12/timothy-garton-ash-tells-islamophobes-to-stop-whingeing.html

need to face reality.

..

European civilization and possibly human life on earth, at least as
we know it, is dying as well.

Liberalism is trying to destroy liberalism.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/cartoonprotests/story/0,,1707576,00.html

http://alcuinbramerton.blogspot.com/2006/02/jyllands-posten-muhammad-cartoon-row_25.html

==Ricketson Comment

Mr. Goode’s comments are thuroughly un-American. In America, we do not conflate religion and nationality. There are a number of countries that do consider religion to be part of nationality– collectively, they care called “the old world”–look to Europe and the Middle East for examples.

Our ancestors came to America to create a new world. If Mr. Goode doesn’t like it, and wants to live in a “Christian” nation, he can leave.

Posted by: Adam Ricketson
Date: December 20, 2006 08:21 PM

= Comment on Ricketson
“In America, we do not conflate religion and nationality.”

Islam does conflate religion with politics.

“Mr. Goode’s comments are thuroughly un-American.”

Therefore, for you, Islam is un-American.

” There are a number of countries that do consider religion to be part of nationality– collectively, they care called “the old world”–look to Europe and the Middle East for examples.”

There is a poll from Jordan University that most Muslims in each Middle East country want Sharia as the sole or a source of law.

So you should object to immigration from them.

Robert Spencer wants a survey as part of immigration. You should support that.

“Our ancestors came to America to create a new world. If Mr. Goode doesn’t like it, and wants to live in a “Christian” nation, he can leave.”

Given your statements, and the above facts, that shows that for you, Muslims should leave. Thus your conclusion is not only that Muslims should not immigrate, but that they should leave.

Goode does not in fact advocate conflating religion and state, but Islam does. Read Jihadwatch.org.

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002206.php

==

“I’ve vacationed in Turkey, and if you’re trying to portray that country as anything less than a secular democracy with the most wonderful people you could ever hope to meet, then there’s no doubt in my mind, you’re a Zionist.” from Jenny above.

After the Pope’s remarks, a priest was killed in Turkey. Search on

Christian Turkey

and add Priest, discrimination, etc. and you will
find many articles on persecution there.

Also add the words site:jihadwatch.org.

The Pope was in Turkey in part to complain about discrimination of Christians. There are many incidents against Christians in Turkey. They don’t have equal rights.

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002189.php

http://thinkprogress.org/2006/12/20/goode-apology/#comment-1300904

..

Its intended by Islam that non-Muslims fear Islam and Muslims. Thus Islam intends Islamophobia in non-Muslims. Islam says to invite people to Islam before attacking them. So Islam intends Islamophobia for non-Muslims.

==

Its intended by Islam that non-Muslims fear Islam and Muslims. Thus Islam intends Islamophobia in non-Muslims. Islam says to invite people to Islam before attacking them. So Islam intends Islamophobia for non-Muslims including Dhimmis living under Islam.

By OldAtlantic | Dec 20, 2006 10:38:43 PM |

==

Old Atlantic, why do you live in the past? Because you are a failure today?

Comment by JPark — December 20, 2006 @ 10:28 pm

Islam from 622 AD has used fear, war, genocide, democide, etc. on non-Muslims. There is no break point at which Islam stopped using such methods. Every majority Muslim land today is engaged in persecution of Christians, regardless of race or national origin.

Its intended by Islam that non-Muslims fear Islam and Muslims. Thus Islam intends Islamophobia in non-Muslims. Islam says to invite people to Islam before attacking them. So Islam intends Islamophobia for non-Muslims including Dhimmis living under Islam.

http://thinkprogress.org/2006/12/20/goode-apology/#comment-1300961

==

#

Old Atlantic…how has Christianity expanded? Would you like me to count the ways? (which are very similar).

Comment by JPark — December 20, 2006 @ 10:46 pm

The Koran was written in 656 AD. Islam attacked the West in 633 AD as Islam according to itself. The Koran was written during occupation of parts of the Eastern Roman Empire. The Koran commands what was done from 633 AD onwards, was being done in 656 AD and what they might want to do. The Caliphate controlled the final version. They put into it what they were doing in the war.

Thus the Koran freezes wartime propaganda as Islam in the Koran. This is unlike Christianity. Christianity lacks the commands in Islam to kill non-believers, etc. See Jihadwatch.org or bin Laden’s Fatwas.

http://thinkprogress.org/2006/12/20/goode-apology/#comment-1301117

==
Immigration causes genetic survival ratios to asymptote to zero. Search on “Unpleasant Immigration Arithemetic”. It is irrational to support sustained immigration because it causes the genetic extinction not only of those here now, but of each year’s cohort of immigrants.

At 300 million steady population, a 75 year lifetime gives 4 million deaths per year. 2 million immigrants then leaves 2 million births in the steady state. 2 million births over 4 million deaths gives a per generation genetic survival ratio of 1/2. Thus in 3 generations one is down to 1/8. If 25 years is the relevant birth to parent time span on average, then one gets extinction in 75 to 100 years. This applies to each annual cohort that comes here. Even if we went to 450 million and had 1 million immigrants per year, similar consequences apply, the deaths per year are 6 million and one gets 5/6 survival ratio per generation. That leads to to about 1/2 in 3 generations or 75 years. So in 150 years one is down to 1/4.
http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002206.php
== Alt Proof Unpleasant Immigration Arithmetic

http://arizona.typepad.com/blog/2006/10/real_real_immig.html

Consider this proof. Suppose the genetic survival probability , p, was greater than epsilon > 0. (We really have p(t,T) where t is some start date and T a later date, but we suppress that notation).

Let N be immigrant genes in from date t at date T.

Np is the average number of genes. Since p > epsilon, Np is greater than N epsilon.

Thus Np > B, for N > B/p for any B.

However, the population must be bounded above by some B.

Thus the expected number of genes is greater than an upper bound, a contradiction.

Thus there does not exist epsilon > 0 such that p > epsilon. Thus the genetic survival probability, p, must asympote to zero as N increases.

“Hardy – Weinberg equilibrium calculations only track the survival of a mutational gene in a population, and have zero bearing on human immigration patterns.” The first post gives a numerical example. The second gives a proof for a stochastic process.

This is largely independent of the mechanism.

==

Genes are large enough to be thought of as tagged or identifiable, they are not quantum particles that are indistinguishable.

You can think of the above proof as applying where we track each gene in perpetuity. Hardy Weinberg doesn’t try to do that in its proof, but simplifies to a form of identical particles, although using classical statistics.

You don’t have to know anything about Hardy Weinberg to follow either the proof or the numerical example. Both of those are valid on their own.

http://arizona.typepad.com/blog/2006/10/real_real_immig.html#comment-26821453

==

 

In Hardy Weinberg derivation at wiki, they assume, dear friend, no migration.

“No migration (gene flow)”

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hardy-Weinberg_principle

“Of course, from a scientific standpoint Old Atlantic’s blather is complete nonsense. Hardy – Weinberg equilibrium calculations only track the survival of a mutational gene in a population, and have zero bearing on human immigration patterns.”

Who is blathering my friend? You try to apply a model with no migration to a migration situation? Who is blathering?

==

“Comment: Pseudo Science! All rubbish garbage!! racist drivel!!”
Posted by:
Date: December 21, 2006 12:41 AM

This is a numerical example. It does simplify some, but its easy to follow and complications wouldn’t change the results. Numerical examples and theorems are not racist drivel.

Another way to see it is as follows. Suppose that genetic survival probabilities were bounded from below by .1. Suppose one had 10 billion people come in. Then .1 times 10 billion is 1 billion. Thus we would have 1 billion genes as the expected value. Suppose the population couldn’t go above 500 million. Then this would show that the genetic survival probability would have to go below .1

There is a tradeoff between genetic survival probabilities, total immigrants entering (a function of time), and the upper bound on population.

There is a substitution effect caused by immigration. As people come in the direct effect is to increase population, but the substitution effect is to substitute for births. This is as old as history.

Immigrants displace natives or prior immigrant cohorts, and that leads to a partial substitution of immigrants for births. Once births fall below replacement, 2.1 births per woman is a standard figure, then the result is declining numbers of genes until either immigration stops or zero is reached. That’s why Buchanan and others talk about the death of the West and low birth rates in Europe and America, the substitution effect in front of our eyes.

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002206.php

== Fertility Rates Europe
Map

http://www.overpopulation.com/faq/Basic_Information/total_fertility_rate/europe.html

This site lets you look at other regions, e.g. Middle East and Central Asia, which have high birth rates. That is part of their problem. It makes them look towards more extreme answers, i.e. hatred of us for the problems causd by their high birth rate. When they come here, they come with the attitude of invaders, and 9-11 is the result of that attitude. Discrimination, street crime, dirty looks, talking behind our backs, paint ball jihadis, SUV jihadis, etc. are lower level forms of this. All of which happens.

==

“They came as a nomadic tribe, and it clearly advocated genocide, specifically of the people of Canaan.”

Islam specifies all non-Muslims.

” Religion tends to have violence and the right to conquest written into it, therefore Islam is no different from many others.”

This concedes the point that Islam is violent. Since you admit Islam is violent, the conclusion is not to want Muslim immigration. That is what Goode said.

“Please take your hate and ignorance somewhere else. Hate is not welcome here.” You are shown to contradict your side of the argument by your statements. Isn’t that a form of intolerance? When you make logical errors and then call your forum colleague a hater, are you not engaged in poor reasoning?

http://thinkprogress.org/2006/12/20/goode-apology/#comment-1301307

==

Darren7160,

Thank you for parsing my argument. My reply is as follows.

“No, he said that Mr. Goode’s position was un-American”

Adam Ricketson used an argument to reach the conclusion. He attributed to Goode the idea that religion and state should be conflated, and based on that Ricketson concluded that Goode was un-American. I then held Ricketson to his claim that conflating religion and state is un-American. Since that is done in Islam, Ricketson is bound by Ricketson’s argument to conclude that Islam, for Ricketson, is un-American.

“Your presumption is that all Muslim immigrants are part of that “most” you cited as wanting Sharia? Are they the most likely to be the ones immigrating to America?”

The 19 on 9-11 clearly did. If we can’t tell, they can’t come. That is in our interest. They don’t have a right to come here.

“And what? By God we will bomb them outta that wish?”

If they can’t come here, they can’t come here and kill us, as they did between WTC 93 and WTC and Pentagon 2001. All the 19 immigrants came in after the WTC 93 attack. Republicans were attacked as bigots for wanting to stop immigration then. Peter Jennings and the MSM realized that on 9-11, realized his guilt, and then pre-emptively attacked restrictionists as bigots to cover up his own guilt. Norman Mineta did the same the next day on profiling. We now know he had warnings before 9-11 that were specific. His reason not to put in profiling on 9-12 was part of the coverup of those warnings. See Complete 9-11 Timeline, which is trying to raise money for a matching grant.

” As long as America holds to its Constitution, no religion will be able to dictate to America…”

The question at issue is how to keep Islam in particular from so dictating. Goode proposes stopping Muslim immigration, which is a sufficient condition, assuming low conversion rates.

“unless we weaken it by blurring the borders with 10 Commandments in courthouses.” The problem is blurring our physical borders by immigration.

I appreciate your personal history in Turkey and taking time to look at my site.

“Turkey is a secular democratic Muslim country that has looked towards Europe and found that Western Europe will never accept them until they “Become Western”.”

They killed a priest after the Pope’s remarks. They have restrictions on Churches. There is still violence against Christians.

“helped us in the first Gulf war.” But not the second.

Also it was the secular Young Turks in control in 1914 who killed over 1 million Christians. That was the secular government. At the same time they helped us in Korea, they also had more violence and discrimination against Christians.

Thank you for your thoughtful comments,

Old Atlantic

Posted by: Old Atlantic
Date: December 21, 2006 09:03 AM

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002206.php#comments

==

“However, my understanding of history is that invading Muslim armies were remarkably tolerant on “infidels” living in their midst.”

Sometimes. The problem is if they eventually get around to genocide, or forcing out, then its not so good. Also the second class status is not so good anyhow. Do we want to be second class in our own country? Isn’t that a reason to stop Muslim immigration? Goode says let’s not be second class to Muslims in America and people call him a bigot for that?

“However, my understanding of history is that invading Muslim armies were remarkably tolerant on “infidels” living in their midst.”

At times they were. But at other times, not. Once they took over, over time, second class status wore people down. There are no longer many Christians in most Muslim countries. Where did they go? They either converted, left or died out. Genocide doesn’t have to happen fast. Most ones are slow.

“If this widespread genocidal tendency of Muslims is true, would there be Spaniards, Greeks, or Serbs today?”

There are few Christians left in Muslim countries today, such as Turkey which had a large Christian population in 1914, see link attached to my name.

The groups you mention refought and reclaimed their lands with help. In Turkey the Christians were genocided by secular Turks. Bethlehem was 85 percent Christian in 1948 and is 12 percent today. Constantinople was over 50 percent Christian in 1914.

Also a group can be subjected to genocide and still have people alive today. Jews were genocided in WWII, but there are still Jews.

” How about Indians in India?” There has been extensive genocide by Muslims against Hindus and others in India.

Tamerlane’s attack on Delhi is an example. There are projections or claims of as high as 70 million.

http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/9391.html

==

http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/014506.php

The depth of their attack is because Goode told the truth.

After WTC 93 attack they should have stopped immigration. Buchanan said to and they called him a racist bigot. The 19 hijackers came in “legally” after WTC 93. The MSM, Democrats, even Republicans had to lie on 9-11 and call restrictionists bigots to cover up their own complicity.

Mineta was covering up the next day. He said no profiling. The truth was he already had specific warnings. On 9-12, Mineta, was covering up the warnings.

Bush gave his religion of peace speech to cover up the August 6, 2001 PDB he got saying “bin Laden determined to attack in the United States”.
Bush had to have a reason to ignore the warning. His reason was that Islam is a religion of peace. That was his cover story for not responding to the warnings.

Bush killed the 3000 people by negligence. If Bush was commander of a ship he would have been court martialed and judged guilty and relieved.
Bush’s face on 9-11 was an, “I should be court martialed look”.

Congress should have impeached him for ignoring those warnings. Bush was covering up and obstructing Congress’s power of impeachment. He still is.

The attack on Virgil Goode, and on Tom Tancredo, etc. are all part of this cover up for the 9-11 guilt.

As much web presence on liberal blogs for this as possible is needed. Putting up basic information in a neutral way will help. What is “obvious” on Jihad Watch is totally unknown to many people.

Just cut and paste snippets with attribution from the many articles is enough to totally turn around and stop the liberal propaganda machine. This is vital. If your local newsaper allows comments, paste there. E-mail your rep or Senator. They are attacking Goode deliberately. They have had him in their sights and been planning this. Its not just spontaneous.

Posted by: Old Atlantic [TypeKey Profile Page] at December 21, 2006 12:51 PM

 

==

 

While sending comments to the Congressmen above, and stay very very polite, also send a copy to one of your Senators or your Congressman. Its better to do one than none.

Senate.gov

You can look up your Senator. Be polite and short and quote a snippet from Jihad Watch that makes them look at it.

House.gov

We want to build mind share with Congress for Jihad Watch. You can’t use html, but just use

http://www.jihadwatch.org.

We were attacked:

WTC 1993

East African embassies August 1998

USS Cole October 2000

WTC and Pentagon 2001.

Not until after the 4th attack did we do anything.

Bin Laden declared war in 1998.


Complete 9-11 Timeline

Can quote from above as well, short with the link as text.


bin Laden’s 1998 Fatwa with bold on quotables

“Nothing is more sacred than belief except repulsing an enemy who is attacking religion and life.” On that basis, and in compliance with Allah’s order, we issue the following fatwa to all Muslims: The ruling to kill the Americans and their allies — civilians and military — is an individual duty for every Muslim who can do it in any country in which it is possible to do it, in order to liberate the al-Aqsa Mosque and the holy mosque [Mecca] from their grip, and in order for their armies to move out of all the lands of Islam, defeated and unable to threaten any Muslim. ”

Posted by: Old Atlantic [TypeKey Profile Page] at December 21, 2006 01:37 PM

 

==

We were attacked, we are at war. Congress is supposed to protect us. That’s in the Constitution. Part of protecting us is stopping immigration by those who already attacked us from the inside. They have to do that, its in the Constitution.

Posted by: Old Atlantic [TypeKey Profile Page] at December 21, 2006 01:40 PM

 

http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/014506.php

==


Oath of Office

Source: Congressional Record (House) – Updated March 10, 2005

OATH OF OFFICE MEMBERS, RESIDENT COMMISSIONER, AND DELEGATES

The oath of office required by the sixth article of the Constitution of the United States, and as provided by section 2 of the act of May 13, 1884 (23 Stat. 22), to be administered to members, Resident Commissioner, and Delegates of the House of Representatives, the text of which is carried in 5 U.S.C. 3331:

“I, AB, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office on which I am about to enter. So help me God.”

has been subscribed to in person and filed in duplicate with the Clerk of the House of Representatives by the following Members of the 109th Congress, pursuant to the provisions of 2 U.S.C. 25

After Pearl Harbor they fulfilled their oath by stopping immigration from Japan and Germany until after World War II was over, and our armies occupied all enemy homelands. They have to stop Muslim immigration until all enemy homelands in the 100 year war the Pentagon has said we are in are occupied or at real peace with us.

Posted by: Old Atlantic [TypeKey Profile Page] at December 21, 2006 01:46 PM

 

==

Christmas jihad

http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/014508.php

 

This is why there shouldn’t be Muslim immigration. How can they predict in advance Muslim terrorist attacks? Isn’t that “racist”?

This is why they attack Virgil Goode, he tells the truth. When they say Muslims will attack us, they should stop their immigration. They can’t have it both ways. If its predictable in advance, they should stop the immigration.
Posted by: Old Atlantic [TypeKey Profile Page] at December 21, 2006 12:45 PM

Troops dying Iraq in Afghanistan is in vain unless we win the war of hearts and minds at home. It may be your loved one who is saved from a future attack. There were sleeper cells from the 1980’s.

See
Complete 9-11 Timeline

Sleeper cells are entering the country legally now.

We need a web presence on liberal blog sites. Just quote snips with attribution from Jihad Watch articles in a neutral fact way. Turn the other cheek when they call you racist and just feed back facts.

Say Virgil Goode speaks for me. Virgil Goode stands up for me and I stand up for Virgil Goode. I join Virgil Goode in saying stop all Muslim immigration now.

They will go crazy, and that’s your opening to feed in facts in a neutral way. They also serve who fight the blog wars.

Posted by: Old Atlantic [TypeKey Profile Page] at December 21, 2006 12:57 PM

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

==

Oath for Senators


Oath of Office


History

oath site:senate.gov


Oath info at Wiki

Posted by: Old Atlantic [TypeKey Profile Page] at December 21, 2006 01:59 PM

 

http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/014506.php

 

==

Preamble Constitution

Preamble
“We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.”
Posted by: Old Atlantic [TypeKey Profile Page] at December 21, 2006 02:03 PM

http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/014506.php

==

When the government predicts another terrorist attack and doesn’t stop Muslim immigration its violating the preamble of the Constitution.

==Paul Begala calls Virgil Goode a bigot.

People die so that Begala can get Democrats elected, or so Begala thinks. Americans shouldn’t die so that the Democratic Party can elect its candidates. The consequence of Muslim immigration is that Americas die. The government says that itself. Saving American lives is not bigotry.

Begala is trading American lives for what he believes will get them votes. Begala deserves neither votes nor to be called anything but tragically mistaken in time of war.

==

barbara.swisher | Dec 21, 2006 5:25:01 PM is right.
quote Stanley_98. Youve got it right mate! end quote

By greenhead | Dec 21, 2006 5:43:58 PM is right. After Pearl Harbor we stopped immigration. We were attacked at WTC by immigrants in 1993 and again in 2001. We should stop immigration until the war is over, just as we did after Pearl Harbor. We didn’t have immigration from Russia during the Cold War. This is no different.

WaPo Comments

==

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002215.php

David Asman: So you do believe there’re too many Middle Easterners here now?(brief pause)

Rep. Virgil Goode: No, I — I said there — and the Diversity Visa program needs to be ended. It shouldn’t have been adopted to begin with, in my opinion.

Asman: But do you think there are too many Middle Easterners in the United States right now?

(brief pause)

Goode: Uh — I’m not gonna say ‘yes’ or ‘no’ on that. I’d like to know the exact number. I don’t have the exact numbers.

Each person is limited to how far they can state the truth beyond the PC boundary. It falls off like the tail of the Gaussian distribution.

Goode has gone well over his limit of truth telling, which is why the PC-pecking hunters are after him.

PC: a method by which all liberals keep all people in a state of fear. (modified from Firing Line debate)

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002215.php

==

Actually it falls off like a modified Bessel function, the MacDonald Function, but that’s being technical.

==

Is it moral to instead of bombing people in Iraq to instead deny the same people immigration to the US? If we catch them there we can kill them, but if they make it here they can get in? Is that superior morality to not letting them in here but not bombing there?

Lest it be said this is an absurd question, Bush, our “Religion of Peace” President, has said that we have to fight them there so we don’t have to fight them here. So its a fair question, is it right to stop immigration here so as to reduce our need to kill them there? Or is it morally wrong to do anything that reduces the pressure on us to kill them there?

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002206.php

==

The above point shows that morality may be trickier during time of war than the time it takes to cry bigot, let loose the dogs of PC war.

==

Should an entire airbase in the US with bombers with nuclear weapons be turned over to immigrants from the Middle East?

If the answer is no, are you a bigot?

Even if they swear an oath on the Koran?

==

Why is it moral to let people come here and kill people here in 1993 and then let more people come here and kill people here in 2001? Isn’t this the Mineta Bush defense?

After 9-11, Mineta said no profiling is moral. Bush agrees. Then we learn Bush had a PDB warning him, “bin Laden determined to attack in the United States.”

Why is it moral for Bush to call those who wanted to stop immigration in 1996 before the 19 hijackers came here legally bigot or Begala? Begala’s Clinton is the one who let them in after WTC 1993 attack? Why can Begala call the victims of his mistake in the 1990’s bigots, but he is a good person to have ignored the attack on the US in 1993 at the WTC?

Why is it right to let people attack WTC in 1993 and do nothing and respond in 2001 to the same people by invading 2 countries? Which is right?

Isn’t the bigot word used to avoid answering this question? Isn’t this just part of the 9-11 coverup, the use of this word bigot?

Aren’t we hearing the samething we heard from Peter Jennings, Mineta and Bush on 9-11, that the people who said stop immigration after WTC 1993 were bigots?

All 3 of them knew more than the average Joe about the threat. None of them warned the average Joe. Why?

Why does Begala threaten to call anyone, including the families of 9-11, bigots for saying no immigration after WTC 93, WTC and Pentagon 2001 ?

Some 9-11 families have called for ending or limiting immigration especially of Muslims. Why doesn’t Begala call them bigots?

Why is it right for Cindy Sheehan to go to Venzuela to call Bush names for her son, but wrong for the 9-11 families to stay in America and say no more immigration?

Why is it right to complain after your family members are killed but not before? How do you complain for yourself? Do you tape a message saying stop immigration, play this after I’m dead? Would that be bigoted because you thought you might be killed by Muslims?

Why are we told that Muslims are going to attack us from within again?

Why do we have immigration from Pakistan which teaches hate of Americans? Same for Saudi Arabia? They teach hate in their elementary schools? Its homework? Should they be let in? Given control over nuclear equiped bombers?

Is it bigotry to keep them from controlling our bombers?

Is it bigotry to deny security clearances to people with families in China or Pakistan? They do it now. Why no cries that this is bigotry?

Why no cry of bigotry when immigrants kill Americans?

Why no cry of bigotry when immigrants give night vision or stealth secrets to China?

Why isn’t it bigotry when American soldiers are killed or maimed by American night vision given to China by Chinese grad students or H-1B’s? Why isn’t that bigotry?

==

Which is morally superior, to ignore a PDB on your desk on August 6, 2001 saying bin Laden determined to attack in the United States, do nothing, let him attack, then praise Islam as the Religion of Peace, then cover up the role of Saudi Arabia and Pakistan not publish the 28 pages in 2003 from the Congressional inquiry linking Saudi Arabia to the financing of 9-11, have a commission the families said was a whitewash, and invade another country Iraq or to say what Goode said?

According to Begala, Goode is beyond the pale, stop Muslim immigration, but what Bush, Norman Mineta, Clinton, Democrats and Republicans did is all fine.

Why is Goode a bigot? But torture is ok as long as you have Korans at Gitmo and don’t flush them down the toilet?

Why is paying off Russia in the 1990’s ok, and concealing it from the USAO Mass, and then letting Pakistan and India do their nuke tests, and all the rest ok? Why is Clinton raping a woman ok? Why is Goode wrong but Clinton right? Why does Begala call Goode a bigot for saying stop Muslim immigration, but calls Clinton friend after a woman comes forward about his raping them while State Attorney General of Arkansas?

If you are in the Club that’s what matters. Goode isn’t in the clubs. Neither were the people in WTC or the Pentagon who couldn’t make it out. Neither are our troops in Iraq and Afghanistan. Who is killing them and why? Does Begala know?

==What isn’t called bigotry:

  1. Letting in the 19 hijackers after WTC 1993 attack, and other warnings.
  2. Not going on a war footing after the WTC 1993 attack.
  3. Not responding to the August 6, 2001 briefing, bin Laden determined to attack in the US.
  4. Chinese immigrants who give US night vision to China.
  5. Indian immigrant who gives US stealth to China.
  6. Foreign profs who don’t give good letters of recommendation to American undergrads for Ph.D. programs but instead admit students of their former profs in their home country.
  7. Later when those same students contribute to giving our secrets or know-how to China.
  8. Letting our night vision end up in the hands of insurgents who use it to kill and maim our troops.
  9. Doing the above in time of war.
  10. Doing the above 13 years after the WTC 1993 attack.
  11. Doing the above 27 years after the 1979 hostage taking in Iran.
  12. Letting Pakistan get nuclear weapons.
  13. Covering up the involvement of Saudi Arabia in financing the Taliban, before, during and after 9-11.
  14. Covering up the involvement of Pakistan in supporting the Taliban, before, during, and after 9-11.
  15. Calling bigot those who wanted to stop immigration when you had classified information all during the Clinton administration in the 1990’s about Muslim plots to kill Americans.
  16. Calling bigot the victims of 9-11 or their families.
  17. Issuing warnings of terrorist attacks by Muslims and calling those who want to stop the immigration of the same people, bigot.
  18. Calling the victims of Muslims engaged in genocide of Christians in Lebanon and Bethlehem bigots for pointing out how its rooted in the Koran.
  19. Concealing that the Armenian genocide was done by Muslims against Christians from those who don’t realize that.
  20. Lying or covering up decisions of Saudi judges that they say is based on the Koran or Islam.
  21. The same for Pakistan, Afghanistan, Somalia, Sudan, Nigeria, Iraq, etc.
  22. Concealing polls from the general public that show non-PC conforming results by Muslims in foreign lands or in the country of immigration.
  23. Not showing Danish Cartoons.
  24. Asking for ritualistic Stalinist Maoist Leftist Orwellian denunciations of people you agree with.
  25. Being put on the spot, after your guy is called a bigot by Begala, of either saying he is a bigot, or losing your career, and having people hang out around your house or school perhaps.
  26. Pretending that there are not Danish Cartoonists in hiding.
  27. Asking Bay Buchanan to denounce Goode as a bigot when CNN was afraid to show the Danish Cartoons for fear of violence against CNN people by Muslims around the world.
  28. Asking people to denounce people on their side, when they know that Danish Cartoonists, French school teachers, politicians, moderate Muslims, Rushdie, authors, etc. are in hiding under death threats for saying the same things as Virgil Goode said.
  29. Pretending that people who denounce Goode while Danish Cartoonists are under death threat are doing so under their own free will.
  30. Pretending that its ok to ask someone to say Goode is a bigot on CNN while there are people in hiding for denouncing Islam or Muhammed.
  31. Pretending that its ok to call Goode a bigot while others are in hiding for saying bad things about Islam.
  32. Talking about Goode’s statement on CNN without saying that CNN was afraid to publish the Cartoons and still doesn’t have them on their website because they have correspondents in Muslim countries who they don’t want killed.
  33. Talking about Goode’s statement on CNN and not admitting that CNN might lose all its offices in every Muslim country if it put the Danish Cartoons on its website.
  34. Making Bay Buchanan denounce Goode while this is going on and pretending its friendly chatter.
  35. Pretending that putting Bay Buchanan in the position of defending Goode was not something that CNN was afraid to do for the Danish Cartoonists and our freedom.
  36. Calling those who have the courage to criticize Islam or Muhammed or call for stopping Muslim immigration when CNN, the New York Times, Washington Post, MSM, etc. were afraid to publish the Cartoons.
  37. Selling out Western Civilization because they are afraid of Muslim violence and have shown it by not publishing the Cartoons.
  38. Being afraid to say the Danish Cartoonists had the right to mock Muhammed and Islam while they were receiving death threats.

==

Thank you Vashine for telling us this. History is made by one person at a time, or two or three at a time. One person can make a difference.

One witness to the truth can change the world, if they have the courage to speak up, and the ability to repeat it endlessly even though nothing seems to happen, no one thanks you, and you never see anything come of it.

Thank you Vashine.

Thank you Virgil Goode.

Thank you Hugh, Robert and fellow posters.

Posted by: Old Atlantic [TypeKey Profile Page] at December 21, 2006 09:06 PM

 

http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/014506.php

 

==

“just said NO”

Just say no to Iran having Nukes.

Just say no to Pakistan keeping nukes.

Just say no to Pakistan putting nukes on missiles on subs off our shores.

Just say no to A Q Khan’s getting their Ph.D.’s in Belgium and taking the secrets of nukes back.

Just say no to not publishing the 28 pages of the Congressional report on Saudi Arabia’s links to financing al Qaeda and 9-11.

Just say no to keeping Pakistan’s role in terrorirsm hidden.

Just say no to PC.

Just say no to Muslim immigration.

Just say no to Islam.

Just say yes to truth.

Thank you Caroline for this phrase and thought.

Posted by: Old Atlantic [TypeKey Profile Page] at December 21, 2006 09:33 PM

 

http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/014506.php

 

Islam is an idea, and you can criticize an idea. That’s in the Constitution. Its in John Locke. Its in Magna Carta. Its in the Bible, just look under truth. Just look under free. You know what free is, don’t you Begala?

I have a dream that one day we shall be free of Islam and the fear of Islam. One day Danish Cartoonists will come out of hiding, join hand in hand with Arab Christians and former Muslims and sing, Free at Last, Free at Last, Thank God Almighty, Free at Last.

 

==

Now that you bring up diversity, Robert Putnam of Harvard has done a study of diversity. Diversity reduces trust not just between groups but even within groups.

Men’s median wages are lower than they were in 1973 due to the 1965 Immigration Act. That might have something to do with it too.

Black men’s labor participation rate has fallen from 1960 to 2006 and prison incarceration rates gone up dramatically. See Steve Sailer at Vdare for that and Borjas of Harvard.

Maybe even 9-11 and all the coverups and shouting bigot after each terrorist incident instead of stopping immigration also pushes trust down.

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002215.php

==

Amendment I – Freedom of Religion, Press, Expression. Ratified 12/15/1791.

From wiki Caliphate

quote

The Caliphate (Arabic خلافة Khilafah) is an Islamic federal government which represents political leadership and unity of the Muslim world (Ummah) applying Islamic law (Shariah). The Caliph is the term for the head of state and it is the only form of government sanctioned in traditional Islamic theology.

end quote

The US first Amendment violates Islam. Islam has the unification of religion and state.

Muhammed and the Caliphs were head of religion and head of state in one person.

The Koran was written in 656 AD during the Caliphate and under its direction.

From wiki on Qu’ran

quote

When at the Battle of Yamama in 633 AD a number of Muslims were killed it was feared that part of the revelations might be lost. Therefore, Abu Bakr, the first Muslim leader after Muhammad’s death, asked Zaid ibn Thabit to collect all the different writing materials on which the Quran was written down.

end quote

This may be too subtle to notice what this implies. 633 AD is when Islam as a unified state and religion single entity attacked the Eastern Roman Empire, the Western superpower, which was Christian and Jewish. The reason they had to write down the Koran was because by attacking the West they were losing their own men in battle. So they had to write down the Koran between conquests.

It was finished in 656 AD while they were occupying provinces of the Eastern Roman Empire they had conquered. The Caliphs made sure the Koran commanded Muslims to do everything they had done from the attack on the Eastern Roman Empire and to Christians and Jews, everything they were doing and everything they might want to do.

After they wrote it they went back to conquering more provinces of the Roman Empire, and killing and genociding Christians, Jews, Hindus and others. That has continued to the present day. They wrote it in 656 AD to command Muslims to do all those things. That was the intended use because they were in occupation and wanted to keep conquering, which they did. The people doing the conquering were in control of the writing of the Koran.

That covers everything up to and after 9-11.

The security code for this entry is fear, how appropriate. Islam if used as intended by Muslims is supposed to create fear in all non-Muslims everywhere.

==

“Wow.

I had no idea.”

Because MSM doesn’t tell you the truth about immigration any more than Islam. See Jihad Watch for the latter, and Lou Dobbs and Vdare for the former.

“Those are the usual explanations offered for the failure of real wages to keep up, or the increase in incarceration rates for black men.”

Borjas has done a study on precisely the impact of immigration on economic opportunity of Black men and precisely on their incarceration rates. You can go to his webpage at Harvard and download it.

“Immigration and African-American Employment Opportunities: The Response of Wages, Employment, and Incarceration to Labor Supply Shocks” September 2006.

You probably didn’t hear of this Harvard study, praised by Greg Mankiw (you know who he is right?) on Mankiw’s blog.

The link by my name has links to Borjas and to Vdare. Search Vdare Borjas for a layman’s guide.
Posted by: Old Atlantic

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002215.php#comments

 

 

 

 

==

“Immigration and African-American Employment Opportunities: The Response of Wages, Employment, and Incarceration to Labor Supply Shocks” September 2006.
from George J. Borjas, Jeffrey Grogger, Gordon H. Hanson

“The employment rate of black men, and particularly of low-skill black men, fell precipitously from 1960 to 2000. At the same time, the incarceration rate of black men rose markedly. This paper examines the relation between immigration and these trends in black employment and incarceration. Using data drawn from the 1960-2000 U.S. Censuses, we find a strong correlation between immigration, black wages, black employment rates, and black incarceration rates. As immigrants disproportionately increased the supply of workers in a particular skill group, the wage of black workers in that group fell, the employment rate declined, and the incarceration rate rose. Our analysis suggests that a 10-percent immigrant-induced increase in the supply of a particular skill group reduced the black wage by 3.6 percent, lowered the employment rate of black men by 2.4 percentage points, and increased the incarceration rate of blacks by almost a full percentage point.”

See link on my name for link to source.

The security code is nose, again how appropriate.

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002215.php

==

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002215.php

Back to the Koran and oath taking. The Koran was written down because on a battlefield in 633 AD, a battle of Islam as a single political-military-religious entity’s choice, some of its soldiers died, and they had bits of Muhammed’s sayings memorized.

So they started writing them down. By 656 AD they had a version. By that time they had conquered provinces of the Eastern Roman Empire and were occupying them.

So they got it from people off the battlefield from 633 AD. That makes it a battle field manual. The Koran is the battle field manual of the attack on the Christian and Jewish Eastern Roman Empire, the Western Superpower, from 633 AD onwards.

So taking the oath on the Koran is like taking an oath during WWII on the German Army’s Battle Field Manual, in German. A Congressman who wanted to do that in 1944, or even 1947, would not have been allowed to take his seat.

The Koran is the battle field manual of the attack of the single unitary religious-military-political entity Islam on the Western superpower from a battlefield of the war in 633 AD on the Western Superpower.

We are the Western Superpower. So the Koran is the battle field manual of the war on us. That war has had as recent battles, the 1979 embassy attack in Iran, the 1993 WTC attack, the 1998 embassy attacks, the 2000 Cole attack, the 9-11 WTC and Pentagon attacks. Note that 2 of those attacks were on embassies.

Our Congressmen should not take an oath of the battle field manual of what is attacking us. Its what attacked us in 633 AD, the Christian Jewish Western Superpower, and on 9-11 2001 AD, the Christian Jewish Western Superpower. That’s us.

And if you want to include Hindus and anyone else, Islam’s been attacking them too.

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002215.php

==

Caroline, good points on Jihad Watch’s contribution to the education of Lawrence Auster. Robert Spencer runs Jihad Watch on the self-discovery method. He tries to hold back on forcing conclusions on us, and just lets us debate in the seminar room.

The result is we come to the conclusions that Hugh, Auster, Vashine, Virgil Goode, etc. come to.

As you and Foehammer point out, Virgil Goode is the Puritan soul to lead us out of the Inferno after a dose of Common Sense at Jihad Watch.

Posted by: Old Atlantic [TypeKey Profile Page] at December 22, 2006 12:22 AM

 

http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/014506.php

 

==

“Men’s median wages are lower than they were in 1973 due to the 1965 Immigration Act. … Black men’s labor participation rate has fallen from 1960 to 2006 and prison incarceration rates gone up dramatically.”

All because of immigration? You mean it doesn’t have anything to do with inflation, or budget deficits,

Inflation as a cause of median wage changes (after adjusting for inflation) over a 30+ time interval is not causal for any economic theory I am aware of. Nor for labor force participation rate of a segment like Black men.

Some of your other variables can have a causal role, of course.

My security code word is rate, which seems appropriate for this note.

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002215.php

==

 

Good points. Being against Muslim immigration is a position to be debated, not one excluded without discussion.

PC Police like Saudi Religious Police say that the conclusion must be agreed to first, (without discussion) and the debate held afterwards, if its allowed, which in this case its not.

==

BTW the Founding Fathers would never permit Muslim immigration while Americans were held as slaves and being crucified. This was actually the case, the Barbary Pirates, actually foreign Muslim governments, were doing just that.

They also wouldn’t have allowed a Muslim to be a member of Congress and take an oath on the Koran while Americans were being snatched off the high seas to be slaves in the name of Islam’s war on the West and Christianity, which they were c. 1800.

1800 Christian Americans taken hostage and made slaves in North Africa.

c. 1900 Ditto.

2001. Americans, Christians and Jews killed on 9-11 at WTC (2nd try by new group of Muslim immigrants from after WTC 93 first try) and Pentagon (First Try).

Projection by 2100: tens of millions of Americans killed by Muslim nuclear weapons, they called it the Muslim bomb themselves in Pakistan as one Hindu reader pointed out at Jihad Watch I think. Europe under Sharia law. America occupied and under Sharia law after it surrenders to the Iran, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia sub flotilla armed with nukes on missiles.

Why would we surrender? Isn’t that what we are debating now? A country that acts like America has convinced the Muslim countries it will surrender. Immigration convinces them they are winning and we won’t fight for Christianity, Atheism, Judaism or Hinduism. They say all the time, we convince them we are surrender material.

So they think they can launch nukes from their subs and we will give up without a fight. Why would we do anything that could lead to our deaths, when we could just surrender? Immigration is surrender. So they think it means surrender to a nuclear attack by them.

They don’t see mutual assured destruction, they see multiculturally assured dhimmis.

We have let Iran, Pakistan, and Saudi Arabia get away with anything they wanted, even attacking us and we’ve always surrendered meekly.  After 9-11, we’ve covered up for Saudi Arabia and Pakistan and given them airlifts out of America and Kunduz respectively, after they were linked to fighting us here and there.  We are Dhimmi cowards and surrenderers.  They can nuke us and we won’t do anything.  We’ve proven it over and over.

We are going to talk ourselves into being nuked by attacking Goode and letting Keith Ellison take the oath on the Koran.  Americans are going to die because of that.   They will attack us because they think its a form of surrender.  The attacks on Goode make that worse.

That’s how they think.  Bin Laden said it in his fatwa or elsewhere.  They think we are Dhimmi Surrender Cowards.  The President of Iran says that all the time.   That’s all we show to them.

We don’t stand up for Danish Cartoonists, for Goode, for Christianity, for Judaism, for anything we say we believe in.  We set up Islamic Republics in Iraq and Afghanistan, i.e. we surrendered.  Bush’s religion of peace speech was a surrender speech. We are contemptible to them.

Immigration is surrender to them. Qaddafi said so.

==
This post is speculation, hypotheses or opinion. All other disclaimers apply.

Iraq a Failure?

December 20, 2006

It is fashionable to regard Iraq as a failure. It is said to be the greatest foreign policy fiasco in US history. Iraq attacked Kuwait in 1990. Iraq shelled missiles on Israel in 1991 during that war. Saddam paid families of suicide bombers in Israel after that.

That prevented peace. That was intended to prolong the war of the Arab Nation against the West, and Israel as a proxy of the Western Superpower, America. Saddam fought an air war. Saddm after his defeat in 1991, attacked the Shiites in the south. Saddam had gassed the Kurds at one point. Saddam defied the UN.
Saddam was put on trial by his own people after the US invasion of Iraq. When the leader is put on trial by his own people, its because something he did was wrong. He killed hundreds of thousands, that was what he did and what he was tried for in part.

Saddam was hoping to get out of sanctions and then build nuclear weapons. Almost every country wanted that. Before the war, the US was blamed for the sanctions. Bin Laden got a fatwa to kill millions of American children in retaliation.

After the war, we are blamed for liberating Saddam. Before the war they said we killed millions of Iraqis by sanctions. After the war, they say we killed hundreds of thousands by war. They blame America before the war for the sanctions, and after the war for the war. When does Saddam get blamed?

They wanted to end the sanctions and then let Saddam build nukes. We know Pakistan was selling nuclear technology. It had to because it had 38 billion in foreign debt, whose interest exceeded its gross exports.

The sanctions could not continue for ever. They also say the sanctions killed more people than they say now the war did and does. They forget that now and only count the gross total figures they come up. They can’t have it both ways.

==Sanctions

http://www.reason.com/news/show/28346.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq_sanctions

Critics of the sanctions say that hundreds of thousands of Iraqis, disproportionately children, died as a result of them, [5] although certain skeptics claim the numbers to be less. [6] [7] [8] UNICEF has put the number of child deaths to 500,000.[9] The reasons include lack of medical supplies, malnutrition, and especially disease owing to lack of clean water. Among other things, chlorine, needed for disinfecting water supplies, was banned as having a “dual use” in potential weapons manufacture. On May 10, 1996, appearing on 60 Minutes, Madeleine Albright (then U.S. Ambassador to the United Nations) was presented with a figure of half a million children under five having died from the sanctions. Not challenging this figure, she infamously replied “we think the price is worth it”, though she later rued the comment as “stupid.”[10]

External links

bin Laden fatwa Iraq children

http://www.fas.org/irp/world/para/docs/980223-fatwa.htm

===Text bin Laden Fatwa ====

News


FAS Note: The following statement from Usama bin Laden and his associates purports to be a religious ruling (fatwa) requiring the killing of Americans, both civilian and military. This document is part of the evidence that links the bin Laden network to the September 11 terrorist attacks on New York and Washington. The original Arabic text of this statement may be found here.


Jihad Against Jews and Crusaders

World Islamic Front Statement

23 February 1998 Shaykh Usamah Bin-Muhammad Bin-Ladin
Ayman al-Zawahiri, amir of the Jihad Group in Egypt
Abu-Yasir Rifa’i Ahmad Taha, Egyptian Islamic Group
Shaykh Mir Hamzah, secretary of the Jamiat-ul-Ulema-e-Pakistan
Fazlur Rahman, amir of the Jihad Movement in Bangladesh
Praise be to Allah, who revealed the Book, controls the clouds, defeats factionalism, and says in His Book: “But when the forbidden months are past, then fight and slay the pagans wherever ye find them, seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem (of war)”; and peace be upon our Prophet, Muhammad Bin-‘Abdallah, who said: I have been sent with the sword between my hands to ensure that no one but Allah is worshipped, Allah who put my livelihood under the shadow of my spear and who inflicts humiliation and scorn on those who disobey my orders. The Arabian Peninsula has never — since Allah made it flat, created its desert, and encircled it with seas — been stormed by any forces like the crusader armies spreading in it like locusts, eating its riches and wiping out its plantations. All this is happening at a time in which nations are attacking Muslims like people fighting over a plate of food. In the light of the grave situation and the lack of support, we and you are obliged to discuss current events, and we should all agree on how to settle the matter. No one argues today about three facts that are known to everyone; we will list them, in order to remind everyone:

First, for over seven years the United States has been occupying the lands of Islam in the holiest of places, the Arabian Peninsula, plundering its riches, dictating to its rulers, humiliating its people, terrorizing its neighbors, and turning its bases in the Peninsula into a spearhead through which to fight the neighboring Muslim peoples. If some people have in the past argued about the fact of the occupation, all the people of the Peninsula have now acknowledged it.

The best proof of this is the Americans’ continuing aggression against the Iraqi people using the Peninsula as a staging post, even though all its rulers are against their territories being used to that end, but they are helpless.

Second, despite the great devastation inflicted on the Iraqi people by the crusader-Zionist alliance, and despite the huge number of those killed, which has exceeded 1 million… despite all this, the Americans are once against trying to repeat the horrific massacres, as though they are not content with the protracted blockade imposed after the ferocious war or the fragmentation and devastation. So here they come to annihilate what is left of this people and to humiliate their Muslim neighbors.

Third, if the Americans’ aims behind these wars are religious and economic, the aim is also to serve the Jews’ petty state and divert attention from its occupation of Jerusalem and murder of Muslims there. The best proof of this is their eagerness to destroy Iraq, the strongest neighboring Arab state, and their endeavor to fragment all the states of the region such as Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Egypt, and Sudan into paper statelets and through their disunion and weakness to guarantee Israel’s survival and the continuation of the brutal crusade occupation of the Peninsula.

All these crimes and sins committed by the Americans are a clear declaration of war on Allah, his messenger, and Muslims. And ulema have throughout Islamic history unanimously agreed that the jihad is an individual duty if the enemy destroys the Muslim countries. This was revealed by Imam Bin-Qadamah in “Al- Mughni,” Imam al-Kisa’i in “Al-Bada’i,” al-Qurtubi in his interpretation, and the shaykh of al-Islam in his books, where he said: “As for the fighting to repulse [an enemy], it is aimed at defending sanctity and religion, and it is a duty as agreed [by the ulema]. Nothing is more sacred than belief except repulsing an enemy who is attacking religion and life.” On that basis, and in compliance with Allah’s order, we issue the following fatwa to all Muslims: The ruling to kill the Americans and their allies — civilians and military — is an individual duty for every Muslim who can do it in any country in which it is possible to do it, in order to liberate the al-Aqsa Mosque and the holy mosque [Mecca] from their grip, and in order for their armies to move out of all the lands of Islam, defeated and unable to threaten any Muslim. This is in accordance with the words of Almighty Allah, “and fight the pagans all together as they fight you all together,” and “fight them until there is no more tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in Allah.” This is in addition to the words of Almighty Allah: “And why should ye not fight in the cause of Allah and of those who, being weak, are ill-treated (and oppressed)? — women and children, whose cry is: ‘Our Lord, rescue us from this town, whose people are oppressors; and raise for us from thee one who will help!'” We — with Allah’s help — call on every Muslim who believes in Allah and wishes to be rewarded to comply with Allah’s order to kill the Americans and plunder their money wherever and whenever they find it. We also call on Muslim ulema, leaders, youths, and soldiers to launch the raid on Satan’s U.S. troops and the devil’s supporters allying with them, and to displace those who are behind them so that they may learn a lesson. Almighty Allah said: “O ye who believe, give your response to Allah and His Apostle, when He calleth you to that which will give you life. And know that Allah cometh between a man and his heart, and that it is He to whom ye shall all be gathered.” Almighty Allah also says: “O ye who believe, what is the matter with you, that when ye are asked to go forth in the cause of Allah, ye cling so heavily to the earth! Do ye prefer the life of this world to the hereafter? But little is the comfort of this life, as compared with the hereafter. Unless ye go forth, He will punish you with a grievous penalty, and put others in your place; but Him ye would not harm in the least. For Allah hath power over all things.” Almighty Allah also says: “So lose no heart, nor fall into despair. For ye must gain mastery if ye are true in faith.”

== end of FAS version bin Laden Fatwa

So bin Laden attacked us in New York and Washington because of sanctions against Iraq. Thus the 3,000 killed on 9-11 2001 were a reprisal for the sanctions on Iraq. It doesn’t matter how inflated bin Laden’s figures may have been. He said he was going to attack us in 1998 beause of Iraq sanctions and in 1998, 2000, and 2001 he did. He killed over 3000 through his 3 attacks.

Bin Laden is the one who attacked us on 9-11. Bin Laden says he did it in part because of Iraq Sanctions. How do we know that? Because bin Laden says it in this fatwa.

==

http://www.anusha.com/osamaint.htm

Transcript of Osama Bin Ladin interview by Peter Arnett

The first-ever television interview with Osama Bin Ladin was conducted by Peter Arnett in eastern Afghanistan in late March 1997. Questions were submitted in advance. Bin Ladin responded to almost all of the questions. CNN was not allowed to ask follow up questions. The interview lasted just over an hour. ARNETT: Mr. Bin Ladin, could you give us your main criticism of the Saudi royal Family that is ruling Saudi Arabia today?


Osama bin Ladin


MR. BIN LADIN: Regarding the criticisms of the ruling regime in Saudi Arabia and the Arabian peninsula, the first one is their subordination to the US. So, our main problem is the US government while the Saudi regime is but a branch or an agent of the US. By being loyal to the US regime, the Saudi regime has committed an act against Islam. And this, based on the ruling of Shari’a (Islamic jurisprudence), casts the regime outside the religious community. Subsequently, the regime has stopped ruling people according to what God revealed, praise and glory be to Him, not to mention many other contradictory acts. When this main foundation was violated, other corrupt acts followed in every aspect of the country, the economic, the social, government services and so on.

REPORTER: Mr. Bin Ladin, if the Islamic movement takes over Arabia, what kind of society will be created and will Saudi Arabia, for example, return to the laws of the Qur’an at the time of the Prophet?

BIN LADIN: We are confident, with the permission of God, Praise and Glory be to Him, that Muslims will be victorious in the Arabian peninsula and that God’s religion, praise and glory be to Him, will prevail in this peninsula. It is a great pride and a big hope that the revelation unto Muhammad, Peace be upon him, will be resorted to for ruling. When we used to follow Muhammad’s revelation, Peace be upon him, we were in great happiness and in great dignity, to God belong credit and praise.

REPORTER: Mr. Bin Ladin, if the Islamic movement takes over Saudi Arabia, what would your attitude to the West be and will the price of oil be higher?

BIN LADIN: We are a nation and have a long history, with the grace of God, Praise and Glory be to Him. We are now in the 15th century of this great religion, the complete and comprehensive methodology, has clarified the dealing between an individual and another, the duties of the believer towards God, Praise and Glory be to Him, and the relationship between the Muslim country and other countries in time of peace and in time of war. If we look back at our history, we will find there were many types of dealings between the Muslim nation and the other nations in time of peace and in time of war, including treaties and matters to do with commerce. So it is not a new thing that we need to come up with. Rather, it already, by the grace of God, exists. As for oil, it is a commodity that will be subject to the price of the market according to supply and demand. We believe that the current prices are not realistic due to the Saudi regime playing the role of a US agent and the pressures exercised by the US on the Saudi regime to increase production and flooding the market that caused a sharp decrease in oil prices.

REPORTER: Mr. Bin Ladin, you’ve declared a jihad against the United States. Can you tell us why? And is the jihad directed against the US government or the United States’ troops in Arabia? What about US civilians in Arabia or the people of the United States?

BIN LADIN: We declared jihad against the US government, because the US government is unjust, criminal and tyrannical. It has committed acts that are extremely unjust, hideous and criminal whether directly or through its support of the Israeli occupation of the Prophet’s Night Travel Land (Palestine). And we believe the US is directly responsible for those who were killed in Palestine, Lebanon and Iraq. The mention of the US reminds us before everything else of those innocent children who were dismembered, their heads and arms cut off in the recent explosion that took place in Qana (in Lebanon). This US government abandoned even humanitarian feelings by these hideous crimes. It transgressed all bounds and behaved in a way not witnessed before by any power or any imperialist power in the world. They should have been considerate that the qibla (Mecca) of the Muslims upheaves the emotion of the entire Muslim World. Due to its subordination to the Jews the arrogance and haughtiness of the US regime has reached, to the extent that they occupied the qibla of the Muslims (Arabia) who are more than a billion in the world today. For this and other acts of aggression and injustice, we have declared jihad against the US, because in our religion it is our duty to make jihad so that God’s word is the one exalted to the heights and so that we drive the Americans away from all Muslim countries. As for what you asked whether jihad is directed against US soldiers, the civilians in the land of the Two Holy Places (Saudi Arabia, Mecca and Medina) or against the civilians in America, we have focused our declaration on striking at the soldiers in the country of The Two Holy Places. The country of the Two Holy Places has in our religion a peculiarity of its own over the other Muslim countries. In our religion, it is not permissible for any non-Muslim to stay in our country. Therefore, even though American civilians are not targeted in our plan, they must leave. We do not guarantee their safety, because we are in a society of more than a billion Muslims. A reaction might take place as a result of US government’s hitting Muslim civilians and executing more than 600 thousand Muslim children in Iraq by preventing food and medicine from reaching them. So, the US is responsible for any reaction, because it extended its war against troops to civilians. This is what we say. As for what you asked regarding the American people, they are not exonerated from responsibility, because they chose this government and voted for it despite their knowledge of its crimes in Palestine, Lebanon, Iraq and in other places and its support of its agent regimes who filled our prisons with our best children and scholars. We ask that may God release them.

REPORTER: Mr. Bin Ladin, will the end of the United States’ presence in Saudi Arabia, their withdrawal, will that end your call for jihad against the United States and against the US ?

BIN LADIN: The cause of the reaction must be sought and the act that has triggered this reaction must be eliminated. The reaction came as a result of the US aggressive policy towards the entire Muslim world and not just towards the Arabian peninsula. So if the cause that has called for this act comes to an end, this act, in turn, will come to an end. So, the driving-away jihad against the US does not stop with its withdrawal from the Arabian peninsula, but rather it must desist from aggressive intervention against Muslims in the whole world.

REPORTER: Mr. Bin Ladin, tell us about your experience during the Afghan war and what did you do during that jihad?

BIN LADIN: Praise be to God, the Cherisher and Sustainer of the worlds, that He made it possible for us to aid the Mujahidin in Afghanistan without any declaration for jihad. It was rather the news that was broadcast by radio stations that the Soviet Union invaded a Muslim country. This was a sufficient motivation for me to start to aid our brothers in Afghanistan. I have benefited so greatly from the jihad in Afghanistan that it would have been impossible for me to gain such a benefit from any other chance and this cannot be measured by tens of years but rather more than that, Praise and Gratitude be to God. In spite of the Soviet power, we used to move with confidence and God conferred favors on us so that we transported heavy equipment from the country of the Two Holy Places (Arabia) estimated at hundreds of tons altogether that included bulldozers, loaders, dump trucks and equipment for digging trenches. When we saw the brutality of the Russians bombing Mujahidins’ positions, by the grace of God, we dug a good number of huge tunnels and built in them some storage places and in some others we built a hospital. We also dug some roads, by the grace of God, Praise and glory be to Him, one of which you came by to us tonight. So our experience in this jihad was great, by the grace of God, praise and glory be to Him, and the most of what we benefited from was that the myth of the super power was destroyed not only in my mind but also in the minds of all Muslims. Slumber and fatigue vanished and so was the terror which the US would use in its media by attributing itself super power status or which the Soviet Union used by attributing itself as a super power. Today, the entire Muslim world, by the grace of God, has imbibed the faithful spirit of strength and started to interact in a good manner in order to bring an end to occupation and the Western and American influence on our countries.

REPORTER: Mr. Bin Ladin, what was the significance of the Afgan war for the Islamic movement? Veterans of that war are fighting for Islamic movements and conflicts from the former Soviet republics such as Chechnya to Bosnia to Algeria. Can you explain that phenomemon to us?

BIN LADIN: As I mentioned in my answer to the previous question, the effect of jihad has been great not only at the level of the Islamic movement but rather at the level of the Muslim nation in the whole world. The spirit of power, dignity and confidence has grown in our sons and brothers for this religion and the power of God, Praise and Glory be to Him. And it has become apparent even to the Islamic movement that there is no choice but return to the original spring, to this religion, to God’s Book, Praise and Glory be to Him, and to the sunna of His Prophet, Peace be upon him, as understood by our predecessors, may God be pleased with them. Of this, the acme of this religion is jihad. The nation has had a strong conviction that there is no way to obtain faithful strength but by returning to this jihad. The influence of the Afghan jihad on the Islamic world was so great and it necessitates that people should rise above many of their differences and unite their efforts against their enemy. Today, the nation is interacting well by uniting its efforts through jihad against the US which has in collaboration with the Israeli government led the ferocious campaign against the Islamic World in occupying the holy sites of the Muslims. As for the young men who participated in jihad here, their number, by the grace of God, was quite big, Praise and Gratitude be to Him, and they spread in every place in which non-believers’ injustice is perpetuated against Muslims. Their going to Bosnia, Chechnya, Tajikistan and other countries is but a fulfillment of a duty, because we believe that these states are part of the Islamic World. Therefore, any act of aggression against any of this land of a span of hand measure makes it a duty for Muslims to send a sufficient number of their sons to fight off that aggression.

REPORTER: Can you tell us now about your expulsion from Saudi Arabia and your time you spent in Sudan and your arrival here in Afganistan?

BIN LADIN: I was, by the grace of God, Praise and Glory be to Him, in the great spot that is dear to God, Praise and Glory be to Him, al-hijaz, especially Venerable Mecca, where is God’s Ancient House. However, the Saudi regime imposed on the people a life that does not appeal to the free believer. They wanted the people to eat and drink and celebrate the praise of God, but if the people wanted to encourage what is right and forbid what is wrong, they can’t. Rather, the regime dismisses them from their jobs and in the event they continued to do so, they are detained in prisons. I have rejected to live this submissive life, by God’s favor, Praise and Gratitude be to Him, that is not befitting of man let alone a believer. So, I waited for the chance until, God, Praise and Glory be to Him, has made it possible for me to leave the country of the Two Holy Places. I hope God, Praise and Glory be to Him, would confer upon me His favor to return one day when God’s law rules in that country. I went to the Sudan and stayed there for aboutfive years during which I visited Afghanistan and Pakistan to work against the Communist government in Kabul. When the Saudi government transgressed in oppressing all voices of the scholars and the voices of those who call for Islam, I found myself forced, especially after the government prevented Sheik Salman al-Awdah and Sheik Safar al-Hawali and some other scholars, to carry out a small part of my duty of enjoining what is right and forbidding what is wrong. So, I collaborated with some brothers and established a committee for offering advice and we started to publish some declarations. (The Advice and Reformation Committee). However, the Saudi regime did not like this and started to exercise pressure on the Sudanese regime. The US government, the Egyptian government and the Yemeni government also helped in doing so. They requested me explicitly from the Sudanese regime and the pressure continued. Saudi Arabia dropped all of its conditions put to the Sudanese regime in return that I be driven out of the Sudan. The US government had already taken the same stance and pulled out its diplomatic mission from Khartoum and put forth their condition to return only after I have left. Unfortunately, the Sudanese government was in some difficult circumstances and there was a tendency inside the government that was inclined to reconciliation or surrender. Then, when they insisted initially that I should keep my mouth shut, I decided to look for a land in which I can breathe a pure, free air to perform my duty in enjoining what is right and forbidding what is wrong. I ask God, Praise and Glory be to Him, for increase in prosperity for this great land, the Land of Khurasan (Afghanistan) in order to carry on this duty. So, we implore God, Praise and Glory be to Him, that He accept (our deeds) from us and the Muslims.

Now, the United States government says that you are still funding military training camps here in Afganistan for militant, Islamic fighters and that you are a sponser of international terrorism; but others describe you as the new hero of the Arab-Islamic world. Are these accusations true? How do you describe yourself?

BIN LADIN: After the collapse of the Soviet Union in which the US has no mentionable role, but rather the credit goes to God, Praise and Glory be to Him, and the Mujahidin in Afghanistan, this collapse made the US more haughty and arrogant and it has started to look at itself as a Master of this world and established what it calls the new world order. It wanted to delude people that it can do whatever it wants, but it can’t do this. It leveled against me and others as many accusations as it desired and wished. It is these (accusations) that you mentioned. The US today as a result of the arrogant atmosphere has set a double standard, calling whoever goes against its injustice a terrorist. It wants to occupy our countries, steal our resources, impose on us agents to rule us based not on what God has revealed and wants us to agree on all these. If we refuse to do so, it will say you are terrorists. With a simple look at the US behaviors, we find that it judges the behavior of the poor Palestinian children whose country was occupied: if they throw stones against the Israeli occupation, it says they are terrorists whereas when the Israeli pilots bombed the United Nations building in Qana, Lebanon while was full of children and women, the US stopped any plan to condemn Israel. At the time that they condemn any Muslim who calls for his right, they receive the highest top official of the Irish Republican Army (Gerry Adams) at the White House as a political leader , while woe, all woe is the Muslims if they cry out for their rights. Wherever we look, we find the US as the leader of terrorism and crime in the world. The US does not consider it a terrorist act to throw atomic bombs at nations thousands of miles away, when it would not be possible for those bombs to hit military troops only. These bombs were rather thrown at entire nations, including women, children and elderly people and up to this day the traces of those bombs remain in Japan. The US does not consider it terrorism when hundreds of thousands of our sons and brothers in Iraq died for lack of food or medicine. So, there is no base for what the US says and this saying does not affect us, because we, by the grace of God, are dependent on Him, Praise and Glory be to Him, getting help from Him against the US. As for the last part of your question, we are fulfilling a duty which God, Praise and Glory be to Him, decreed for us. We look upon those heroes, those men who undertook to kill the American occupiers in Riyadh and Khobar (Dhahran). We describe those as heroes and describe them as men. They have pulled down the disgrace and submissiveness off the forehead of their nation. We ask Allah, Praise and Glory be to Him, to accept them as martyrs.

REPORTER: Let’s go to the bombings of United States troops in Riyadh and Dhahran. Why did they happen and were you and your supporters involved in these attacks?

BIN LADIN: We ask about the main reason that called for this explosion. This explosion was a reaction to a US provocation of the Muslim peoples, in which the US transgressed in its aggression until it reached the qibla of the Muslims in the whole world. So, the purpose of of the two explosions is to get the American occupation out (of Arabia). So if the U.S. does not want to kill its sons who are in the army, then it has to get out.

Q: On the same issue of the American troops in Saudi Arabia, do you think will be more bombing attacks on them? or attacks on U.S. civilians in Arabia? or assassination attempts for example, on the Saudi royal families?

BIN LADIN: As for the previous question, the explosion of Riyadh and the one in Al-Khobar (Dhahran). It is no secret that during the two explosions, I was not in Saudi Arabia, but I have great respect for the people who did this action. I say, as I said before, they are heroes. We look upon them as men who wanted to raise the flag of “There is no God but Allah”, and to put an end the non believers and the state of injustice that the U.S. brought. I also say that what they did is a great job and a big honor that I missed participating in.

Q) Do you think there will be more bombing attacks on American troops in Saudi Arabia? or attacks on American civilians in Saudi Arabia? or will there be assassination attempts on the Saudi Arabian ruling family?

BIN LADIN: It is known that every action has its reaction. If the American presence continues, and that is an action, then it is natural for reactions to continue against this presence. In other words, explosions and killings of the American soldiers would continue. These are the troops who left their country and their families and came here with all arrogance to steal our oil and disgrace us, and attack our religion. As for what was mentioned about the ruling (Saudi) family those in charge, do bear the full responsibility of everything that may happen. They are the shadow of the American presence. The people and the young men are concentrating their efforts on the sponsor and not on the sponsored. The concentration at this point of Jihad is against the American occupiers.

Q) What are your views about Sheik Omar Abdul Rahman and have you ever met him? Do you know him?

BIN LADIN: Sheik Omar Abdul Rahman is a Muslim scholar well-known all over the Muslim world. He represents the kind of injustice that is adopted by the U.S. A baseless case was fabricated against him even though he is a blind old man. We ask Allah, The Almighty, to relieve him. The U.S. sentenced him to hundreds of years just to please its caprice and the whims of the Egyptian regime. He is now very badly treated and in no way fit for an old man like him or any Muslim scholar.

Q) The U.S. State Department quoting a Pakistani official says that Ramzi Yousef, a convicted bomber in the World Trade Center in New York City stayed in the house you funded in Peshawar, Pakistan for those receiving training during the Afghan conflict after the Trade Center bombing, is that true? Did Ramzi Yousef stay in your house in Peshawar?

BIN LADIN: I do not know Ramzi Yousef. What the American government and Pakistani intelligence has been reporting is not true at all. But I say if the American government is serious about avoiding the explosions inside the U.S., then let it stop provoking the feelings of 1,250 million Muslims. Those hundreds of thousands who have been killed or displaced in Iraq, Palestine, Lebanon, do have brothers and relatives. They would make of Ramzi Yousef a symbol and a teacher. The U.S. will drive them to transfer the battle into the United States. Everything is made possible to protect the blood of the American citizen while the bloodshed of Muslims is allowed in every place. With this kind of behavior, the U.S. government is hurting itself, hurting Muslims and hurting the American people.

Q) Mr. Bin Ladin, were you involved in financing the bombing of the World Trade Center in New York City?

BIN LADIN: I have no connection or relation with this explosion.

Q) Mr. Bin Ladin, in a recent interview with an Arabic newspaper, you said that Arabs who fought in the Afghan war killed U.S. troops in Mogadishu, Somalia. Can you tell us about that?

BIN LADIN: The U.S. government went there with great pride and stayed there for some time with a strong media presence wanting to frighten people that it is the greatest power on earth. It went there with pride and with over 28,000 soldiers, to a poor unarmed people in Somalia. The goal of this was to scare the Muslim world and the whole world saying that it is able to do whatever it desires. As soon as the troops reached the Mogadishu beaches, they found no one but children. The CNN and other media cameras started photographing them (the soldiers) with their camouflage and heavy arms, entering with a parade crawling (on the ground) and showing themselves to the world as the “greatest power on earth”. Resistance started against the American invasion, because Muslims do not believe the U.S. allegations that they came to save the Somalis.A man with human feelings in his heart does not distinguish between a child killed in Palestine or in Lebanon, in Iraq or in Bosnia. So how can we believe your claims that you came to save our children in Somalia while you kill our children in all of those places?

With Allah’s grace, Muslims over there, cooperated with some Arab “Mujahideen” who were in Afghanistan. They participated with their brothers in Somalia against the American occupation troops and killed large numbers of them. The American administration was aware of that. After a little resistance, The American troops left after achieving nothing. They left after claiming that they were the largest power on earth. They left after some resistance from powerless, poor, unarmed people whose only weapon is the belief in Allah The Almighty, and who do not fear the fabricated American media lies. We learned from those who fought there, that they were surprised to see the low spiritual morale of the American fighters in comparison with the experience they had with the Russian fighters. The Americans ran away from those fighters who fought and killed them, while the latter were still there. If the U.S. still thinks and brags that it still has this kind of power even after all these successive defeats in Vietnam, Beirut, Aden, and Somalia, then let them go back to those who are awaiting its return.

Q) Mr. Bin Lladin, your family is a rich powerful family in Saudi Arabia. Have they, or the Saudi Arabian government asked you to stop your activities?

BIN LADIN: They have done that a lot. They have pressured us a lot, especially since a lot of our money is still in the hands of the Saudi ruling family due to activities of the our family and company (Saudi construction giant, the BinLadin Group). They sent me my mother, my uncle, and my brothers in almost nine visits to Khartoum (Sudan) asking me to stop and return to Arabia to apologize to King Fahd. I apologized to my family kindly because I know that they were driven by force to come to talk to me. This regime wants to create a problem between me and my family and in order to take some measures against them. But, with Allah’s grace, this regime did not get its wish fulfilled. I refused to go back. They (my family) conveyed the Saudi government’s message that if I did not go back, they’ll freeze all my assets, deprive me of my citizenship, my passport, and my Saudi I.D. and distort my picture in the Saudi and foreign media. They think that a Muslim may bargain on his religion. I said to them do whatever you may wish. It is with Allah’s bounty, we refused to go back. We are living in dignity and honor for whom we thank Allah. It is much better for us to live under a tree here on these mountains than to live in palaces in the most sacred land to Allah, while being subjected to disgrace not worshipping Allah even in the most sacred land on earth, where injustice is so widespread. There is no strength except with Allah.

Q) Mr. Bin Ladin, have Saudi agents attempted to assassinate you? Are you targeted by the U.S. government? Are you in fact in fear of your life?

BIN LADIN: The U.S. pressures are no secret to you. The Saudi pressures are also in response to American pressures. There were several attempts to arrest me or to assassinate me. This has been going on for more than seven years. With Allah’s grace, none of these attempts succeeded. This is a proof in itself to Muslims and to the world that the U.S. is incapable and weaker than the picture it wants to draw in people’s mind. A believer must rest assured that life is only in the hands of Allah, and sustenance is also in the hands of Allah, the Almighty. As for fearing for one’s life, it is difficult to explain to you how we think of ourselves, unless you have full belief. We believe that no one could take out one breath of our written life as ordained by Allah. We see that we see that getting killed in the cause of Allah is a great honor wished for by our Prophet (PBUH). He said in his Hadith: “I swear to Allah, I wish to fight for Allah’s cause and be killed, I’ll do it again and be killed, and I’ll do it again and be killed”. Being killed for Allah’s cause is a great honor achieved by only those who are the elite of the nation. We love this kind of death for Allah’s cause as much as you like to live. We have nothing to fear for. It is something we wish for.

Q) What are your future plans?

BIN LADIN: You’ll see them and hear about them in the media, God willing.

Q) Mr. Bin Ladin, if you had an opportunity to give a message to President Clinton, what would that message be?

BIN LADIN: Mentioning the name of Clinton or that of the American government provokes disgust and revulsion. This is because the name of the American government and the name of Clinton and Bush directly reflect in our minds the picture of children with their heads cut off before even reaching one year of age. It reflects the picture of children with their hands cut off, the picture of the children who died in Iraq, the picture of the hands of the Isrealis with weapons destroying our children. The hearts of Muslims are filled with hatred towards the United States of America and the American president The President has a heart that knows no words. A heart that kills hundreds of children definitely, knows no words. Our people in the Arabian Peninsula will sent him messages with no words because he does not know any words. If there is a message that I may send through you, then it is a message I address to the mothers of the American troops who came here with their military uniform walking proudly up and down our land while the scholars of our country are thrown in prisons. I say that this represents an a blatant provocation to 1,250 million Muslims. To these mothers I say if they are concerned for their sons, then let them object to the American government’s policy and to the American president. Do not let themselves be cheated by his standing before the bodies of the killed soldiers describing the freedom fighters in Saudi Arabia as terrorists. It is he who is a terrorist who pushed their sons into this for the sake of the Isreali interest. We believe that the American army in Saudi Arabia came to separate between the Muslims and the people for not ruling in accordance with Allah’s wish. They came to be in support of the Israeli forces in occupied Palestine, the land of the “Israa” of our Prophet (PBUH).

Napoleon in the White House

December 20, 2006

“Iraq is Bush’s Waterloo – will it be America’s, too?” by Justin Raimondo. “When our president looks in the mirror, whom does he see? Lincoln? FDR? Churchill? Napoleon is more like it. Our expedition to Iraq bears a striking resemblance to the Little Corporal’s march on Russia – or, perhaps, Hitler’s version of the same mistake.”

Comment

Raimondo rates Bush a corporal in military strategy. Iraq is not just Bush’s Vietnam, its his Russia campaign. But is that correct? Napoleon’s army died. It died from starvation, cold, partisans and a majorb battle, Borodino outside Smolensk in 1812 on the road to Moscow.

Moscow was burned by the Russians. Napoleon decided there wasn’t enough food there, so he left and his army walked back to Poland in winter. The Russian army pursued it. It died on the way.

Now its true that Bush has built an Iraqi army composed of Muslim fighters who sympathize with Sadr’s militia more than Bush on occaision, but it is still not denying our troops basic supplies. Bush has made building the army of a hostile people his goal. This ranks as one of the great follies of history. But it is still not Bush’s Russia.

Raimondo says give up our bases in Iraq, instead of using them to invade Iran. As Reagen would say, these are my bases Mr. Raimondo, I paid for them with the lives of 3,000 Americans and British and coalition soldiers. We should not let that sacrifice be in vain. We can use those bases to invade Iran and save lives in that invasion.

Fight Iran we must. That is already decided by Iran and their view of Islam. We can either fight them from bases on 3 sides, or we can give up those bases and fight for position again. There is no better base to defeat Iran than the base we have built in Iraq.

Battle phase deaths in Iraq were under 200. Occupation phase deaths are 70 per month. For 3 months death we can invade Iran, if those numbers applied. Even at 1000, we are talking 14 months of Iraq occupation.

In World War II we would pay more for one island. We need to swap islands. Iraq is worthless. We need to remove the nuclear, sub, and missile capability of Iran. Then we need to move our army to the Pakistan border, blockade them by sea, and make them give up their nukes, subs and missiles.

Pakistan is putting minature nuclear warheads on missiles on subs as its next step. Those subs will be sold to Iran, Saudi Arabia, UAE, etc. Why? Because Pakistan can’t afford to maintain a nuclear, missile and sub program without selling what it makes. It is over 30 billion dollars in debt. Its interest payments exceeds its gross exports. It has to sell what it makes. That is why it sold what A Q Khan made.

The time to fight wars is when battle phase deaths are 200. We save lives by a ground invasion. This is because we use our bases in Iraq and we avoid their retaliation with missiles against our ships. We could lose over 200 lives from one ship going down. That is why a ground invasion is safer than letting them get revenge on our ships with missiles.

== Info on Napoleon’s Invasion of Russia in 1812

From Wiki

On June 24, 1812, the Grande Armée of 691,501 men, the largest army assembled up to that point in European history, crossed the river Neman and headed towards Moscow.

Military losses amounted to 300,000 French, 70,000 Poles, 50,000 Italians, 80,000 Germans and perhaps 450,000 Russians. As well as the loss of human life the French also lost some 200,000 horses and over 1,000 artillery pieces.

As far as is known, Bush hasn’t lost any horses. Military losses for the French side were 500,000, summing the above numbers out of the initial 691,501. Note the Russians lost 450,000 killed, and they are considered to have won.

Coalition losses from March 2003 through Dec 19, 2006 are 3199. See http://www.icasualties.org/oif/

Current Time in Baghdad: 4:42:24 PM
Period US UK Other* Total Avg Days

The time to fight wars is when these are the casualties, not the 500,000 killed Napoleon lost. How could they kill 500,000 of us? With nuclear weapons. We should invade Iran and then surround Pakistan and denuke it. We must do that before they have nukes on missiles on subs off our coasts. We must act now.

We have bases on 3 sides of Iran. This is staring victory in the face. This is the opposite of Napoleon in Russia in 1812. We have victory in our grasp, instead we choose to let our enemy get nuclear weapons. This is self hate and folly.

This article is speculation, hypotheses or opinion. All other disclaimers apply.

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Prison Rape of White Men by Black and Hispanic Men

December 18, 2006

http://www.vdare.com/francis/prison_rape.htm

from Vdare’s Sam Francis

There are more men raped in the United States—about 140,000 every year—than women—a mere 90,000. (figures corrected from Am Ren) Most of the male rapes take place , and good many of them are interracial, with blacks and Hispanics searching out and raping white men. [No Escape: Male Rape in U.S. Prisons]

The stories the report recounts, described in a 2002 article in the newsletter American Renaissance, are graphic and repellent. “I had no choice but to submit to being Inmate B’s prison wife,” one white convict said. “In all reality, I was his slave.… I determined I’d be better off to willingly have sex with one person, than I would be to face violence and rape by multiple people. The most tragic part to this is that the person I chose to ‘be with’ has AIDS.”

 

Another white prisoner in Michigan reported that the black inmate who “claimed me as his property” “publicly humiliated and degraded me, making sure all the inmates and guards knew that I was a queen and his property. Within a week he was pimping me out to other inmates at $3.00 a man. This state of existence continued for two months until he sold me for $25.00 to another black male who purchased me to be his wife.” Those are only a couple of the less lurid stories from the Human Rights Watch report.

As the report puts it, “African Americans typically face sexual abuse at the hands of other African Americans, and Hispanics at the hands of other Hispanics. Some inmates told Human Rights Watch that this pattern reflected an inmate rule, one that was strictly enforced: ‘only a black can turn out [rape] a black, and only a chicano can turn out a chicano.’ Breaking this rule by sexually abusing someone of another race or ethnicity, with the exception of a white inmate, could lead to racial or ethnic unrest, as other members of the victim’s group would retaliate against the perpetrator’s group.”

Read it all

See James T. Fulford “Two Words Missing From This Headline”

Death Wish Question by Richard Poe at Front Page Mag

Comments on Poe

http://www.hrw.org/reports/2001/prison/

http://www.hrw.org/reports/2001/prison/video.html

http://www.vdare.com/francis/index.htm

http://www.samfrancis.net/

search “No Escape: Male Rape in U.S. Prisons”

Stop Prison Rape

http://www.supremecourtus.gov/docket/03-636.htm

ACLU argues for rights of black inmate to rape white inmates is in effect what this case was.

Garrison S. Johnson v. California, 03-636

Press Release of ACLU. Sandra Day O’Connor upholds right of black and hispanic inmates to rape whites in prison.

http://www.aclu.org/scotus/2004/13927prs20050223.html

Decision of US Sup Ct.

The victims of this decision were never represented even though the ACLU and possibly Proskauer, Rose, LLP provided pro bono help to Johnson to get his rape shot on white men.

Steven R. Shapiro was for ACLU.

==

No. 03-636
Title:
Garrison S. Johnson, Petitioner
v.
California, et al.
Docketed: October 29, 2003
Lower Ct: United States Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit
Case Nos.: (01-56436)
Decision Date: February 25, 2003
Rehearing Denied: July 28, 2003
Questions Presented
~~~Date~~~ ~~~~~~~Proceedings and Orders~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Oct 27 2003 Petition for a writ of certiorari filed. (Response due November 28, 2003)
Nov 18 2003 Waiver of right of respondents California, et al. to respond filed.
Dec 3 2003 DISTRIBUTED for Conference of January 9, 2004.
Dec 8 2003 Response Requested . (Due January 7, 2004)
Dec 31 2003 Order extending time to file response to petition to and including January 28, 2004.
Jan 27 2004 Brief of respondents James Gomez and James Rowland in opposition filed.
Feb 9 2004 Reply of petitioner Garrison S. Johnson filed.
Feb 11 2004 DISTRIBUTED for Conference of February 27, 2004.
Mar 1 2004 Petition GRANTED.
Mar 15 2004 Extension of time to file the joint appendix and petitioner’s brief on the merits to and including May 17, 2004.
Mar 15 2004 Extension of time within which to file respondents’ brief on the merits to and including July 21, 2004.
May 6 2004 Further extension of time within which to file the joint appendix and petitioner’s brief on the merits to and including June 4, 2004.
May 18 2004 Brief amicus curiae of Pacific Legal Foundation filed.
Jun 3 2004 Joint appendix filed.
Jun 3 2004 Brief of petitioner Garrison S. Johnson filed.
Jun 4 2004 Brief amici curiae of American Civil Liberties Union,et al. filed.
Jun 4 2004 Brief amicus curiae of United States filed.
Jun 4 2004 Brief amicus curiae of Former State Corrections Officials filed.
Jun 16 2004 Further extension of time within which to file respondent’s brief on the merits to and including August 6, 2004.
Aug 6 2004 Brief of respondents James Gomez and James Rowland filed.
Aug 6 2004 Brief amicus curiae of National Association of Black Law Enforcement Officers, Inc. filed.
Aug 6 2004 Brief amici curiae of Utah, et al. filed.
Aug 18 2004 Motion of the Solicitor General for leave to participate in oral argument as amicus curiae and for divided argument filed.
Aug 19 2004 CIRCULATED.
Sep 1 2004 SET FOR ARGUMENT Tuesday, November 2, 2004.
Sep 10 2004 Reply of petitioner Garrison S. Johnson filed. (Distributed).
Sep 27 2004 Record received from U.S.C.A. 9th Circuit. (1 envelope)
Sep 28 2004 Motion of the Solicitor General for leave to participate in oral argument as amicus curiae and for divided argument GRANTED.
Sep 28 2004 Record received from U.S.D.C. Central California. (1 box and 1 envelope)
Nov 2 2004 Argued. For petitioner: Bert H. Deixler, Los Angeles, Calif., and for the United States, as amicus curiae, Paul D. Clement, Acting Solicitor General, Department of Justice, Washington, D.C. For respondent: Frances T. Grunder, Senior Assistant Attorney General, San Francisco, Calif.
Feb 23 2005 Judgment REVERSED and case REMANDED. O’Connor, J., delivered the opinion of the Court, in which Kennedy, Souter, Ginsburg, and Breyer, JJ., joined. Ginsburg, J., filed a concurring opinion, in which Souter and Breyer, JJ., joined. Stevens, J., filed a dissenting opinion. Thomas, J., filed a dissenting opinion, in which Scalia, J., joined. Rehnquist, C. J., took no part in the decision of the case.
Mar 28 2005 JUDGMENT ISSUED.
Apr 12 2005 Record returned to U.S.C.A.-9th Circuit.
Apr 12 2005 U.S.D.C. record for the Central District of California returned to Judge Diarmuid F. O’Scannlain of the U.S.C.A.-9th Circuit.

~~Name~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~Address~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~Phone~~~
Attorneys for Petitioner:
Bert H. Deixler Proskauer, Rose, LLP (310) 557-2900
Counsel of Record 2049 Century Park East
Suite 3200
Los Angeles, CA 90067
Party name: Garrison S. Johnson
Attorneys for Respondents:
Frances T. Grunder Office of the Attorney General (415) 703-5723
Counsel of Record 455 Golden Gate Avenue, #11000
San Francisco, CA 94102-7004
Party name: California, et al.
Other:
Elizabeth Alexander Natl Prison Project of ACLU (202) 393-4930
733 15th Street, NW
Washington, DC 20005
Party name: American Civil Liberties Union,et al.
Paul D. Clement Solicitor General (202) 514-2217
United States Department of Justice
950 Pennsylvania Avenue, N.W.
Room 5614
Washington, DC 20530-0001
Party name: United States
John H. Findley Pacific Legal Foundation (916) 419-7111
3900 Lennane Drive, Suite 200
Sacramento, CA 95834
Party name: Pacific Legal Foundation
David Thomas Goldberg 99 Hudson Street, 8th Floor (212) 334-8813
New York, NY 10013
Party name: National Association of Black Law Enforcement Officers, Inc.
Gene C. Schaerr Winston & Strawn LLP (202) 282-5000
1700 K Street, N.W.
Washington, DC 20006
Party name: Utah, et al.
Michael C. Small Mr. (310) 229-1000
Akin, Gump, Strauss, Hauer & Feld, L.L.P.
2029 Century Park East,,
Suite 2400
Los Angeles, CA 90067
Party name: Former State Corrections Officials

http://www.supremecourtus.gov/docket/03-636.htm

O-bomb-a and the War Party

December 18, 2006

“Barack Obama: He’s more of the same
…” by Justin Raimondo December 18, 2006.

“The pretty-boy face and the accomplished actor’s polished technique aside, Barack Obama is just another shill for the War Party. And the sooner antiwar Democrats realize that, the better.”

Justin Raimondo bombs all over Obama. Why? Because Obama, in Raimondo’s view, is all war and no peace. Whether we can be that hopeful, or this is just Raimondo’s sourness is supported by apt quotes Raimondo sprinkles through his ranticide.

Obama has, however, indicated that bombing Iran and Pakistan is only a last resort, instead of the consummation so devoutly to be wished. Actually, a ground invasion is the thing to capture the nukes of the opposing king.

Fear keeps his watch in every old man’s eye, and where fear lodges lets hope more nuclear weapons will not be allowed to ripen bye and bye.

Is Obama ready to cry havoc, let loose the tanks of war? Will he send a young generation to conquer in Persia, or will he shrink back into the comforting failure of Democratic establishment politics, saying it is our Archie Bunker selves that are to blame for our defeat. Actually, a long Marxist rant, which they somehow think is original will be what they say, but we spare the reader that.

Obama mania sweeps the nation, or at least the self important national talk show hosts. Is Obama the warrior king to lead us in the last great battle against Islam? Or should we look for a warrior queen in that role?

Raimondo’s rant is no real guide to tell us. For him they are both the same, shills for, gasp, the Israel lobby. Why can’t the Israel lobby give us an authentic Patton or Sharon to add a million men to our army and roll over our enemies from one end of the Middle East to the other? Why do they send us pygmies to be our leaders? They must not get all the iodized salt that Steve Sailer keeps talking about at Vdare.

Readers can provide their own quotation marks around Shakespeare’s bits. This article is hypotheses, speculation or opinion.

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General Says Army Will Need To Grow

December 15, 2006

“Iraq and Afghanistan Are Straining the Force, Chief of Staff Warns”

“Warning that the active-duty Army ‘will break’ under the strain of today’s war-zone rotations, the nation’s top Army general yesterday called for expanding the force by 7,000 or more soldiers a year and lifting Pentagon restrictions on involuntary call-ups of Army National Guard and Army Reserve…”

from Ann Scott Tyson
Washington Post Staff Writer
Friday, December 15, 2006; Page A0

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/12/14/AR2006121400803.html

Comment

We need 1 million more at a cost of 120 billion dollars a year more. That’s what war is about. With 1 million more troops, we might get NoKo, Iran and Pakistan to give up their nukes, subs and missiles without having to go to war. That’s the real way to save.

Related story

http://today.reuters.com/news/articlenews.aspx?type=domesticNews&storyID=2006-12-15T012023Z_01_N14443457_RTRUKOC_0_US-CRIME-USA-CHINA.xml&WTmodLoc=USNewsHome_C2_domesticNews-6

“U.S. says ex-Chinese national sold military secrets”

Stop immigration, Support our troops. Senator Cornyn’s Skil Bill will make this worse, more foreign workers displacing Americans and selling our secrets. This technology ends up in the hands of insurgents who use it to kill and maim our troops.

How does that save us money? Maimed troops back from Iraq and Afghanistan are more in proportion to deaths than prior wars. We then have to spend at least 1 million per person over their lifetime.

For 50,000 maimed troops that comes to 50 billion dollars. How is that savings?

Senator Warner supports this know how transfer and is outgoing Chairman of Armed Services. Why can’t he support our troops? Incoming Chairman Carl Levin also voted for increasing H1B in 2005. See

http://jobdestruction.com/shameh1b/Library/Politicians/Levin.htm

So when will the Armed Services Chairman and ranking member support our troops, and save money?

This article represents hypotheses, speculation or opinion. All other disclaimers apply.

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