Archive for the 'PC-pecking' Category

Virgil Goode Right: Stop Muslim Immigration

December 20, 2006

We must stop Muslim immigration to save Western civilization and ultimately our own lives. Political Correctness about Islam or Muslims is lethal.

Why is it moral to bomb people in Iraq but not moral to stop them coming here to kill us? They can’t come here and kill us if they can’t come here. Why is it moral to bomb people in Iraq but not moral to keep the same people coming here as immigrants?

There should be no immigration in time of war. Virgil Goode is right. Stop immigration. This is where we decide whether to win this war or not.

Many people, who disagree with Goode, and many who agree with him will feel they must call me or others on my side bigot. People should feel free to take back those words or move on from them to the substance of the debate.
If people are overcome by PC, that should be ignored as well. Everyone should feel free to revise and extend their remarks because they felt overcome by PC. Its a daily experience we all feel, called fear.

PC-pecking, A method by which all Liberals keep all people in a state of fear. (paraphrase from Firing Line debate many years back on henpecking.)

Surgeons have what the call bleed time. This is a period of time after the first incision. In our PC drenched culture, the equivalent is bigot calling time. This is an initial period when a liberal, or a PC fearful conservative, has to call others bigot, even if they agree with them.

When asked as a ritual to call others bigot, point it out. I decline to call Virgil Goode a bigot. Like Reagen, can turn it around and say, I decline to call my opponent mean spirted or lacking in courtesy.

This debate should be had in good humor. The excesses of rhetoric on both sides should be regarded as good clean fun. We must, in time of war, hold ourselves to the consequences of our choices, not to the high spirits of the debate. We must all live together with the deaths of our people that will continue in this war, both here and there.
Over 3,000 people were killed in the terrorist incidents up to and including 9-11. More have died since then here and there. We owe this debate our best arguments. If that requires use of rhetoric on either side that is a little heavy going, we should respond on the basis of substance. It also allows people to take back what they said or move on, and always to focus on the substance and the consequences.

All remarks here or elsewhere by me should be understod to be revised in that way. There are so many remarks calling this author a bigot that it would be impossible to keep track of them all or even a portion.
This post is draft and preliminary and represents some notes on posts made at various sites. This post will be cleaned up and revised as time permits.

==

December 20th, 2006 at 10:18:21 From: Fallaci Admirer

bin Laden’s Fatwa: Kill Americans
“We — with God’s help — call on every Muslim who believes in God and wishes to be rewarded to comply with God’s order to kill the Americans and plunder their money wherever and whenever they find it.”

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/terrorism/international/fatwa_1998.html

They believe the Koran commans them to kill every American. “On that basis, and in compliance with God’s order, we issue the following fatwa to all Muslims: The ruling to kill the Americans and their allies — civilians and military — is an individual duty for every Muslim who can do it in any country in which it is possible to do it”

http://www.rawstory.com/comments/24293.html

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/terrorism/international/fatwa_1998.html

==

bin Laden’s Fatwa: Kill Americans

“We — with God’s help — call on every Muslim who believes in God and wishes to be rewarded to comply with God’s order to kill the Americans and plunder their money wherever and whenever they find it.”

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/terrorism/international/fatwa_1998.html bin Laden Fatwa 1998

They believe the Koran commands “every Muslim to kill the Americans, civilians and military”.

“On that basis, and in compliance with God’s order, we issue the following fatwa to all Muslims: The ruling to kill the Americans and their allies — civilians and military — is an individual duty for every Muslim who can do it in any country in which it is possible to do it”

And in August 1998, embassies, Cole 2000, WTC 2001 and Pentagon 2001, etc. they did it according to this Fatwa. 9-11 was done by legal immigrants who came after the WTC 1993 attack.

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002189.php

==

THE INTERNATIONAL
LESBIAN AND GAY ASSOCIATION

“1. Sources

The primary source for Islamic Law is the Koran. The second element is known as the Sunna, these being the teachings of the Prophet Mohammed and his oldest disciples not explicitly found in the Koran. The third element of Shari’a Law is known as the Ijma. These are rules developed on the basis of debate and subsequent consensus among religious scholars and the Moslem community as a whole. When these three main sources fail to provide adequate guidance, they are supplemented by a system in which the jurist can draw parallels with the first three sources (the Qiyas). Finally, there are several other methods for developing judgements, each of which allows increased use of discretion by the jurist. These latter sources allow for the development of Shari’a Law in more liberal jurisdictions, but are rejected in more conservative jurisdictions.”

“In the Hadith, homosexual behaviour is condemned harshly: “whenever a male mount another male, the throne of God trembles”……… if you see two people who act like the people of Lot, then kill the active and the passive”.”

“Legal Sanctions
The punishment that the Islamic jurists generally prescribe for adultery, and therefore also for homosexual behaviour, is stoning to death for married people, and 100 lashes for unmarried people…”


Gays flee Iraq as Shia death squads find a new target” Jennifer Copestake Guardian August 6, 2006.

http://observer.guardian.co.uk/world/story/0,,1838222,00.html

http://www.ilga.info/Information/Legal_survey/middle%20east/supporting%20files/sharia_law.htm

Sharia Koran

http://www.google.com/search?q=Sharia+Koran&sourceid=mozilla-search&start=0&start=0&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official

http://www.omdurman.org/sharia.html

==

http://www.omdurman.org/sharia.html


Saudi Religious Police burn schoolgirls to death for being improperly dressed Saudi police ‘stopped’ fire rescue
Saudi Arabia’s religious police stopped schoolgirls from leaving a blazing building because they were not wearing correct Islamic dress, according to Saudi newspapers.”

“TEHRAN (Reuters) – An Iranian man cut off his seven- year-old daughter’s head after suspecting she had been raped by her uncle, the Jomhuri-ye Eslami newspaper said on Sunday.
…”The motive behind the killing was to defend my honor, fame, and dignity,” the paper quoted the father as saying. (Source)”

“Judicial Rape in Iran and the Sudan
Women, Islam & Equality describes Iran’s version of the “Muslim” religion:

According to a “religious” decree, virgin women prisoners must as a rule be raped before their execution, “lest they go to Paradise.””

==

” It (US) also leads in murders and other violent felonies.”

Search

murder site:Vdare.com

crime immigration site:Vdare.com

crime immigration site:Amren.com

Borjas black site:Vdare.com

“The employment rate of black men in the United States fell precipitously from 89.6 percent in 1960 to 76.1 percent in 2000… The decline in labor market participation among black men was accompanied by a rapid increase in the number of black men in correctional institutions. As recently as 1980, only 0.8 percent of black men … were incarcerated. By 2000, 9.6 percent of black men … were incarcerated.”

From Steve Sailer

http://www.vdare.com/sailer/060924_crime.htm

==

December 20th, 2006 at 11:27:11 From: Fallaci Admirer
“UK: Police killer escapes in veil”
http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/014490.php

http://www.rawstory.com/comments/24311.html

==

http://islamstrueface.blogspot.com/2005/07/muslim-atrocities.html

“All other religions, despite their bloody past are now only concerned with personal piety and spiritual development of their followers. Some of them also get involved in works of charity like Salvation Army, Habitat for Humanity, etc. But Muslims are the only group that still thinks of Jihad, and expansion of their religion through violent means. Muslims are the only group that believes their god has given them the mission to kill those who reject him. Muslims are the only group that still endeavors to impose the antiquated misogynistic laws of their “holy” book. And Muslims are the only group that has not apologized for the crimes of their past and keeps committing those crimes even today.”

“I am a former muslim convert, and the religion of Islam fascinated me. Being the pacifist i was, i was drawn to the “religion of peace.” Until i discovered the truth about the religion, and my purpose is to share it with you I intend by all means neccesary to remain anonymous, for death is the punishment for apostates and those who speak ill of Islam. Contact me at: kaffirtruthseeker@hotmail.com”

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002187.php

Muslim atrocities

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&hs=0mO&sa=X&oi=spell&resnum=0&ct=result&cd=1&q=Muslim+atrocities&spell=1

http://biblia.com/islam/islam.htm

==

December 20th, 2006 at 11:55:50 From: Fallaci Admirer
MSM bemoans defeat
What is new and interesting in this op-ed blog? The MSM don’t like being confronted with fact. Men’s median wages are lower today than in 1973. This is caused by immigration that Wall Street Journal pushes. Black men’s incarceration rates are up from before the 1965 Immigration Act to today by an increase in a factor of ten, from less then 1 percent to about 9 percent. The percentage employed drop by a similar figure. Its this fact, the WSJ doesn’t want pushed back at it. See

http://www.vdare.com/sailer/060924_crime.htm

“The employment rate of black men in the United States fell precipitously from 89.6 percent in 1960 to 76.1 percent in 2000… The decline in labor market participation among black men was accompanied by a rapid increase in the number of black men in correctional institutions. As recently as 1980, only 0.8 percent of black men … were incarcerated. By 2000, 9.6 percent of black men … were incarcerated.” by Steve Sailer. WSJ doesn’t want this feedback instantly.

http://www.rawstory.com/comments/24321.html

==

“Spencer’s Truth About Muhammad banned in Pakistan!”

http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/014495.php

==

December 20th, 2006 at 12:44:39 From: Fallaci Admirer
“Ignorance” about Islam, Jihadwatch the cure
“Sixth month in jail for Saudi woman involuntarily divorced from husband by half-brothers”

http://www.jihadwatch.org/dhimmiwatch/archives/014488.php

==

“2006: The Year Of Perpetual Muslim Outrage”

By Michelle Malkin

http://www.vdare.com/malkin/061219_outrage.htm

==

December 20th, 2006 at 12:55:39 From: Fallaci Admirer

Save the soldiers, invade Iran now
They also serve who keep our total deaths lower. Fighting now does that. We lost 6,825 on Iwo Jima, from Wiki. That was one battle. We lost under 200 in the combat phase in Iraq. We could defeat all the main enemy homelands, Iran, Pakistan and Saudi Arabia for less. We paid 3000 occupation phase deaths for the Iraqi bases. We have bases on 3 sides of Iran. Battle phase deaths in Iraq were under 200. Time to fight wars is when battle phase deaths are 200. We will lose millions when they have nukes or more of them come here by immigration and kill us here. They can’t kill us here if we don’t let them come here.

http://www.rawstory.com/comments/24293.html

==

“Only to the same extent it was a “problem” to have a large Catholic immigrant population in a traditionally Protestant one. That is, people like Goode may have a problem with it but who cares?”

<a href=”http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&hs=i0Q&q=%22Christian+genocide%22&btnG=Search”&gt;
Christian genocide” </a>

==

“Only to the same extent it was a “problem” to have a large Catholic immigrant population in a traditionally Protestant one. That is, people like Goode may have a problem with it but who cares?”

<a href=”http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&hs=i0Q&q=%22Christian+genocide%22&btnG=Search”&gt;
Christian genocide” </a>

No Muslim land has not forced out or genocided all the non-Muslims, or isn’t doing it now.

http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/9391.html

http://digg.com/political_opinion/Rep_Virgil_Goode_does_his_part_to_help_spread_Islam#c4353375

==

“No Muslim land has not forced out or genocided all the non-Muslims, or isn’t doing it now.

Unless I really don’t understand the situation in Darfur, your comment is incorrect unless you want to get pendantic and technical in your parsing (i.e. “Muslim land”). ” from Edo

First, a technical response, then a response on Darfur.
Darfur genocide is described by CS Monitor as Arab Muslims on black Muslims as victims. This is not in conflict with the statement “No Muslim land has not forced out … the non-Muslims”, since Darfur as so-described is not part of the subject matter of this statement.

Now as for Darfur.

“Sudan, like most African postcolonial states, is partially a victim of imperial cartography. Thoughtlessly carved out by the British during the 19th-century scramble to claim Africa, Sudan is a forced crucible of Muslim Arabs and black Africans. The blacks in the south either hew to their ancestral traditional African religions or have converted to Christianity. The fact that black Africans in Darfur are exclusively Muslim has not stopped the Arab Janjaweed militias and the government from exterminating them.”

<a href=”http://www.csmonitor.com/2004/0714/p09s02-coop.html”&gt;
CS Monitor on Darfur </a>

Arab Muslims consider blacks, Muslim or not to be not their equals. Arab Muslims for centuries had a slave trade in blacks that involved their not surviving long term.

Basically, the Arabs for over a 1000 years took blacks as slaves and then didn’t breed them as in the old South in the US but instead prevented that by various means. The result of this history is a permanent state of mind of Arabs towards blacks.

This comes from the time when Arabs were Muslim and blacks were not. The same treatment is being applied to the blacks by the Arabs today as in the time that blacks were not Muslim.

Thus the Darfur genocide is inherited from prior genocide by Arab Muslims of blacks for centuries as part of their slave management methods.

==

“No Muslim land has not forced out or genocided all the non-Muslims, or isn’t doing it now.

Unless I really don’t understand the situation in Darfur, your comment is incorrect unless you want to get pendantic and technical in your parsing (i.e. “Muslim land”). ” from Edo

First, a technical response, then a response on Darfur.
Darfur genocide is described by CS Monitor as Arab Muslims on black Muslims as victims. This is not in conflict with the statement “No Muslim land has not forced out … the non-Muslims”, since Darfur as so-described is not part of the subject matter of this statement.

Now as for Darfur.

“Sudan, like most African postcolonial states, is partially a victim of imperial cartography. Thoughtlessly carved out by the British during the 19th-century scramble to claim Africa, Sudan is a forced crucible of Muslim Arabs and black Africans. The blacks in the south either hew to their ancestral traditional African religions or have converted to Christianity. The fact that black Africans in Darfur are exclusively Muslim has not stopped the Arab Janjaweed militias and the government from exterminating them.”

<a href=”http://www.csmonitor.com/2004/0714/p09s02-coop.html”&gt;
CS Monitor on Darfur </a>

Arab Muslims consider blacks, Muslim or not to be not their equals. Arab Muslims for centuries had a slave trade in blacks that involved their not surviving long term.

Basically, the Arabs for over a 1000 years took blacks as slaves and then didn’t breed them as in the old South in the US but instead prevented that by various means. The result of this history is a permanent state of mind of Arabs towards blacks.

This comes from the time when Arabs were Muslim and blacks were not. The same treatment is being applied to the blacks by the Arabs today as in the time that blacks were not Muslim.

Thus the Darfur genocide is inherited from prior genocide by Arab Muslims of blacks for centuries as part of their slave management methods.

See Susan Stephen on <a href=”http://www.faithfreedom.org/Articles/SStephan/islamic_slavery.htm”>Arab Slave Trade </a>

http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/9391.html

==

December 20th, 2006 at 16:06:53 From: Fallaci Admirer
Immigration => Exploitation
Taking contrapositives, no exploitation implies no immigration.

http://www.rawstory.com/comments/24342.html

this is correct.

there can’t be an absence of exploitation unless there
is an absence of immigration.

look at truth table.

Immigration => exploitation

I=> E is true, means following pairs allowed

I E
-I E
-I -E

the pair not allowed is I,-E.

so -E implies -I

http://www.geocities.com/CollegePark/Classroom/9912/easterntrade.html


The survival rate of this process ranged from 1 in 10 to 1 in 30.

http://www.csmonitor.com/2004/0714/p09s02-coop.html

http://www.scaruffi.com/politics/slavetra.html

http://africanhistory.about.com/library/weekly/aa040201a.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darfur_conflict

http://www.csmonitor.com/2004/0714/p09s02-coop.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1998_U.S._embassy_bombings

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dar_es_Salaam

Arabs slaves blacks

http://www.google.com/search?q=Arabs+slaves+blacks&sourceid=mozilla-search&start=0&start=0&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official

http://www.jihadwatch.org/dhimmiwatch/archives/2005/11/009139print.html

http://www.scaruffi.com/politics/slavetra.html

Arab slavery

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_in_Somalia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tanzania#The_Maji_Maji_War

http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=17747

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biafra#Meaning_of_the_word_.22Biafra.22_and_location_of_Biafra

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maji_Maji

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Political_map_of_Somalia_showing_Jowhar.png

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scramble_for_Africa

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Place_in_the_sun

http://www.democrats.com/node/11451

http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/9391.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1998_U.S._embassy_bombings

http://africanhistory.about.com/library/weekly/aa040201a.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tanzania

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zanzibar#Slave_and_ivory_trade

http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=17747

Christians Ottomans

==

“Muslims For A Safe America conducted a survey at the Islamic Society of North America’s 43rd Annual Convention in Chicago from September 1, 2006 to September 4, 2006. 307 Muslims who are American citizens participated in the survey at the Muslims For A Safe America booth at ISNA,” the organization reports. Some respones:

2. Do you consider yourself to be a Muslim first, an American first, or both equally?
MUSLIM FIRST 214
AMERICAN FIRST 4
BOTH EQUALLY 86
UNDECIDED 3

3. Is the American government at war with the religion of Islam?
YES 208
NO 79
UNDECIDED 20

5. Did Muslims hijack planes and fly them into buildings on 9/11?
YES 117
NO 139
UNDECIDED 51

6. Did the U.S. government have advance knowledge of the 9/11 attacks, and allow the attacks to occur?
YES 200
NO 70
UNDECIDED 37
7. Did the U.S. government organize the 9/11 attacks?
YES 106
NO 151
UNDECIDED 50

8. Are the tapes of Osama Bin Laden, claiming responsibility for the 9/11 attacks and threatening future attacks, real or fake?
REAL 126
FAKE 129
UNDECIDED 52

9. Did Muslims commit the July 2005 train and bus bombings in London?
YES 140
NO 104
UNDECIDED 63

21. Should Iran develop nuclear weapons?
YES 161
NO 123
UNDECIDED 23

25. Was America justified in invading Afghanistan after 9/11?
YES 51
NO 248
UNDECIDED 8

The organization notes that “this was NOT a scientific survey, because ISNA Convention attendees who visited the Muslims For A Safe America booth are not necessarily representative of the American Muslim community as a whole.” We really hope so.

Posted by Daniel Freedman at October 26, 2006 11:22 AM

<a href=”http://www.shinesforall.com/archives/2006/10/muslims_for_a_s.html”&gt;
Source </a>

http://www.shinesforall.com/archives/2006/10/muslims_for_a_s.html

=

“Muslim first” “american first”

http://blogsearch.google.com/blogsearch?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&q=%22Muslim+first%22++%22american+first%22&btnG=Search+Blogs

http://www.americanthinker.com/2006/11/will_islam_dominate_the_future.html


The other principal focus of Steyn’s book is on the inability of contemporary multiculturalism to provide a meaningful, vigorous base on which to sustain and defend Western civilization. On the contrary, as Steyn sharply remarks,

‘multiculturalism was conceived by the Western elites not to celebrate all cultures but to deny their own.’

Hence, ‘the governing principle of multicultural society’ is that ‘Western man demonstrates his cultural sensitivity by pre—emptively surrendering.’ This already is happening in Europe, which Steyn thoroughly documents. But it even is happening in the United States — see the craven response by our political and media establishment to last year’s Cartoon Intifada, and the continued refusal by our law enforcement agencies to engage in ‘racial profiling’ as part of a sensible anti—terrorism strategy. Steyn surely is correct that multiculturalism, and its philosophical twin internationalism, cannot provide the ideological meat needed to maintain a healthy body politic.

Airplanes

cameras in toilets.

people will be cleaner too.

http://blog.washingtonpost.com/postglobal/needtoknow/2006/08/historical_parallels_to_todays.html

http://www.amren.com/mtnews/archives/2006/02/poll_reveals_40.php

http://www.swordscrossed.org/node/754 “we are all Hizballah now.”

http://www.americanthinker.com/2006/11/will_islam_dominate_the_future.html

http://www.digitalbrownpajamas.com/digital_brownpajamas/2006/08/index.html


Being a Muslim first is a wholly different thing from being a Christian first.


Being Muslim first brought about the kinds of countries that oppress, enslave, and murder their own people, motivating them by the hundreds of thousands to flee those countries to places like this one, and then criticize it.

Being a Christian first causes me to pray for the conversion of Muslims to engage them where possible in conversation to convince them to believe in Christ and be saved.

Being Muslim first causes them to threaten the infidel with death by the sword, to infiltrate nations in the desire to bring them under Sharia.

http://www.womenswallstreet.com/columns/column.aspx?aid=946&p=1

Operation Bojinka

http://michellemalkin.com/archives/005699.htm

http://hotair.com/archives/2006/06/22/the-great-divide-pew-surveys-muslim-public-opinion/

http://pewglobal.org/reports/display.php?ReportID=253

==
==

“I am laughing at Old Atlantic… I could post just as much stuff from the Bible that makes Christians look like Christianofascists!” from Happy Monkey. These are things happening now and being said now.

They are a continuation of the same things from the past. There is no break point for Islam.

“Have you ever heard of Turkey? A Muslim country to the very core, yet ruled under a civil code of law for the last century?” from Robert.

See URL attached to this post for source and link to NY Times from 1914.

The last century goes back to include 1914.

The Young “secular” Turks were in power in Turkey by 1914. They continued the same genocide of Christians that was going on in the 1890’s. They killed over 1 million Christians.

“From January 13, 1915 New York Times:

“Talaat Bey, the Minister of the Interior, has stated to the Councillor of the Greek Patriarchate that in Turkey henceforth there will be room only for Turks. While he was profuse in assurance to the Greek Minister regarding the cessation of anti- Greek persecutions, no real amelioration of the situation is perceptible.””

http://www.omdurman.org/sharia.html is about things happening now.

9-11 happened in 2001. Did you laugh on that day at those who said to stop Muslim immigration? All 19 hijackers were immigrants from after the WTC 1993 attack. No immigration, no 3000 killed.

What purpose does immigration serve? Men’s median wages are below what they were in 1973? You are programmed to want your own destruction. You are frustrated when someone tells the truth, that is why so many react to Virgil Goode.

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002189.php

http://www.hoffmania.com/blog/2006/12/dennis_prager_j.html#comment-26817138


Sooner or later every Muslim land genocides or forces out non-Muslims. This is going on today in Lebanon, Bethlehem, etc.

Posted by: Old Atlantic | Dec 20, 2006 5:22:17 PM

Countries are the way they are because of the people.

Australia and NZ are different than surrounding countries because of the people.

If they come from those countries, they behave that way. America will become those countries. That is happening with Hispanic immigration.

http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/9391.html

http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/9391.html

29.

Reply to Edo.

The Arab Muslims in Sudan have for centuries exploited blacks, Muslim or not in Sudan. This includes slavery and other bad treatment. You must have somehow misunderstood my comment.

“your claim that all genocides are Christian is just as false”

I think this is the root of your misconception. The issue with Virgil Goode is whether he is right that Muslim immigration is a threat. The proposition that Muslim lands end up genociding non-Muslims goes to that issue. The question is whether have a positive probability to genocide non-Muslims. If so, then allowing their immigration reduces welfare to non-Muslims here. That proves Muslim immigration should not be allowed. That’s the issue.

Muslims have genocided Christians, Jews, Hindus, Zoroastrians, Africans with other beliefs, and others.

Since the Darfur genocide victims are primarily Muslim and the genociders are Muslim, Judaism and Christianity are not directly relevant. However, the Arab Muslims in Sudan get their tendency to genocide blacks in Sudan, even black Muslims, from their history of genocide of non-Muslim blacks in Africa. That is the meaning of the inheritance, i.e. genocide of black Muslims in Sudan is inherited from genocide of blacks.

Think of black as the root, and Muslim as a branch. The branch inherits from the root. In this case its a little more complicated since its a relation from Arab Muslims to blacks, but that relation can inherit as well.

The prior genocide by Arab Muslims of those in the south of Sudan did involve many Christians as victims.

Comment by Old Atlantic — 12/20/2006 @ 8:36 pm
30.

That should have been black as root and black Muslim as the branch.

Comment by Old Atlantic — 12/20/2006 @ 8:38 pm

..

If Muslims discriminate, commit crime, or genocide non-Muslims that is a reason to keep them out.

and if non Muslims do those things to Muslims its a reason to keep the Muslims out.
(to prevent this)

the former is a reason even if the latter is.

..

Liberalism is anti-West and hates West.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/comment/story/0,,1705411,00.html

http://www.islamophobia-watch.com/islamophobia-watch/2006/10/12/timothy-garton-ash-tells-islamophobes-to-stop-whingeing.html

need to face reality.

..

European civilization and possibly human life on earth, at least as
we know it, is dying as well.

Liberalism is trying to destroy liberalism.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/cartoonprotests/story/0,,1707576,00.html

http://alcuinbramerton.blogspot.com/2006/02/jyllands-posten-muhammad-cartoon-row_25.html

==Ricketson Comment

Mr. Goode’s comments are thuroughly un-American. In America, we do not conflate religion and nationality. There are a number of countries that do consider religion to be part of nationality– collectively, they care called “the old world”–look to Europe and the Middle East for examples.

Our ancestors came to America to create a new world. If Mr. Goode doesn’t like it, and wants to live in a “Christian” nation, he can leave.

Posted by: Adam Ricketson
Date: December 20, 2006 08:21 PM

= Comment on Ricketson
“In America, we do not conflate religion and nationality.”

Islam does conflate religion with politics.

“Mr. Goode’s comments are thuroughly un-American.”

Therefore, for you, Islam is un-American.

” There are a number of countries that do consider religion to be part of nationality– collectively, they care called “the old world”–look to Europe and the Middle East for examples.”

There is a poll from Jordan University that most Muslims in each Middle East country want Sharia as the sole or a source of law.

So you should object to immigration from them.

Robert Spencer wants a survey as part of immigration. You should support that.

“Our ancestors came to America to create a new world. If Mr. Goode doesn’t like it, and wants to live in a “Christian” nation, he can leave.”

Given your statements, and the above facts, that shows that for you, Muslims should leave. Thus your conclusion is not only that Muslims should not immigrate, but that they should leave.

Goode does not in fact advocate conflating religion and state, but Islam does. Read Jihadwatch.org.

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002206.php

==

“I’ve vacationed in Turkey, and if you’re trying to portray that country as anything less than a secular democracy with the most wonderful people you could ever hope to meet, then there’s no doubt in my mind, you’re a Zionist.” from Jenny above.

After the Pope’s remarks, a priest was killed in Turkey. Search on

Christian Turkey

and add Priest, discrimination, etc. and you will
find many articles on persecution there.

Also add the words site:jihadwatch.org.

The Pope was in Turkey in part to complain about discrimination of Christians. There are many incidents against Christians in Turkey. They don’t have equal rights.

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002189.php

http://thinkprogress.org/2006/12/20/goode-apology/#comment-1300904

..

Its intended by Islam that non-Muslims fear Islam and Muslims. Thus Islam intends Islamophobia in non-Muslims. Islam says to invite people to Islam before attacking them. So Islam intends Islamophobia for non-Muslims.

==

Its intended by Islam that non-Muslims fear Islam and Muslims. Thus Islam intends Islamophobia in non-Muslims. Islam says to invite people to Islam before attacking them. So Islam intends Islamophobia for non-Muslims including Dhimmis living under Islam.

By OldAtlantic | Dec 20, 2006 10:38:43 PM |

==

Old Atlantic, why do you live in the past? Because you are a failure today?

Comment by JPark — December 20, 2006 @ 10:28 pm

Islam from 622 AD has used fear, war, genocide, democide, etc. on non-Muslims. There is no break point at which Islam stopped using such methods. Every majority Muslim land today is engaged in persecution of Christians, regardless of race or national origin.

Its intended by Islam that non-Muslims fear Islam and Muslims. Thus Islam intends Islamophobia in non-Muslims. Islam says to invite people to Islam before attacking them. So Islam intends Islamophobia for non-Muslims including Dhimmis living under Islam.

http://thinkprogress.org/2006/12/20/goode-apology/#comment-1300961

==

#

Old Atlantic…how has Christianity expanded? Would you like me to count the ways? (which are very similar).

Comment by JPark — December 20, 2006 @ 10:46 pm

The Koran was written in 656 AD. Islam attacked the West in 633 AD as Islam according to itself. The Koran was written during occupation of parts of the Eastern Roman Empire. The Koran commands what was done from 633 AD onwards, was being done in 656 AD and what they might want to do. The Caliphate controlled the final version. They put into it what they were doing in the war.

Thus the Koran freezes wartime propaganda as Islam in the Koran. This is unlike Christianity. Christianity lacks the commands in Islam to kill non-believers, etc. See Jihadwatch.org or bin Laden’s Fatwas.

http://thinkprogress.org/2006/12/20/goode-apology/#comment-1301117

==
Immigration causes genetic survival ratios to asymptote to zero. Search on “Unpleasant Immigration Arithemetic”. It is irrational to support sustained immigration because it causes the genetic extinction not only of those here now, but of each year’s cohort of immigrants.

At 300 million steady population, a 75 year lifetime gives 4 million deaths per year. 2 million immigrants then leaves 2 million births in the steady state. 2 million births over 4 million deaths gives a per generation genetic survival ratio of 1/2. Thus in 3 generations one is down to 1/8. If 25 years is the relevant birth to parent time span on average, then one gets extinction in 75 to 100 years. This applies to each annual cohort that comes here. Even if we went to 450 million and had 1 million immigrants per year, similar consequences apply, the deaths per year are 6 million and one gets 5/6 survival ratio per generation. That leads to to about 1/2 in 3 generations or 75 years. So in 150 years one is down to 1/4.
http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002206.php
== Alt Proof Unpleasant Immigration Arithmetic

http://arizona.typepad.com/blog/2006/10/real_real_immig.html

Consider this proof. Suppose the genetic survival probability , p, was greater than epsilon > 0. (We really have p(t,T) where t is some start date and T a later date, but we suppress that notation).

Let N be immigrant genes in from date t at date T.

Np is the average number of genes. Since p > epsilon, Np is greater than N epsilon.

Thus Np > B, for N > B/p for any B.

However, the population must be bounded above by some B.

Thus the expected number of genes is greater than an upper bound, a contradiction.

Thus there does not exist epsilon > 0 such that p > epsilon. Thus the genetic survival probability, p, must asympote to zero as N increases.

“Hardy – Weinberg equilibrium calculations only track the survival of a mutational gene in a population, and have zero bearing on human immigration patterns.” The first post gives a numerical example. The second gives a proof for a stochastic process.

This is largely independent of the mechanism.

==

Genes are large enough to be thought of as tagged or identifiable, they are not quantum particles that are indistinguishable.

You can think of the above proof as applying where we track each gene in perpetuity. Hardy Weinberg doesn’t try to do that in its proof, but simplifies to a form of identical particles, although using classical statistics.

You don’t have to know anything about Hardy Weinberg to follow either the proof or the numerical example. Both of those are valid on their own.

http://arizona.typepad.com/blog/2006/10/real_real_immig.html#comment-26821453

==

 

In Hardy Weinberg derivation at wiki, they assume, dear friend, no migration.

“No migration (gene flow)”

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hardy-Weinberg_principle

“Of course, from a scientific standpoint Old Atlantic’s blather is complete nonsense. Hardy – Weinberg equilibrium calculations only track the survival of a mutational gene in a population, and have zero bearing on human immigration patterns.”

Who is blathering my friend? You try to apply a model with no migration to a migration situation? Who is blathering?

==

“Comment: Pseudo Science! All rubbish garbage!! racist drivel!!”
Posted by:
Date: December 21, 2006 12:41 AM

This is a numerical example. It does simplify some, but its easy to follow and complications wouldn’t change the results. Numerical examples and theorems are not racist drivel.

Another way to see it is as follows. Suppose that genetic survival probabilities were bounded from below by .1. Suppose one had 10 billion people come in. Then .1 times 10 billion is 1 billion. Thus we would have 1 billion genes as the expected value. Suppose the population couldn’t go above 500 million. Then this would show that the genetic survival probability would have to go below .1

There is a tradeoff between genetic survival probabilities, total immigrants entering (a function of time), and the upper bound on population.

There is a substitution effect caused by immigration. As people come in the direct effect is to increase population, but the substitution effect is to substitute for births. This is as old as history.

Immigrants displace natives or prior immigrant cohorts, and that leads to a partial substitution of immigrants for births. Once births fall below replacement, 2.1 births per woman is a standard figure, then the result is declining numbers of genes until either immigration stops or zero is reached. That’s why Buchanan and others talk about the death of the West and low birth rates in Europe and America, the substitution effect in front of our eyes.

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002206.php

== Fertility Rates Europe
Map

http://www.overpopulation.com/faq/Basic_Information/total_fertility_rate/europe.html

This site lets you look at other regions, e.g. Middle East and Central Asia, which have high birth rates. That is part of their problem. It makes them look towards more extreme answers, i.e. hatred of us for the problems causd by their high birth rate. When they come here, they come with the attitude of invaders, and 9-11 is the result of that attitude. Discrimination, street crime, dirty looks, talking behind our backs, paint ball jihadis, SUV jihadis, etc. are lower level forms of this. All of which happens.

==

“They came as a nomadic tribe, and it clearly advocated genocide, specifically of the people of Canaan.”

Islam specifies all non-Muslims.

” Religion tends to have violence and the right to conquest written into it, therefore Islam is no different from many others.”

This concedes the point that Islam is violent. Since you admit Islam is violent, the conclusion is not to want Muslim immigration. That is what Goode said.

“Please take your hate and ignorance somewhere else. Hate is not welcome here.” You are shown to contradict your side of the argument by your statements. Isn’t that a form of intolerance? When you make logical errors and then call your forum colleague a hater, are you not engaged in poor reasoning?

http://thinkprogress.org/2006/12/20/goode-apology/#comment-1301307

==

Darren7160,

Thank you for parsing my argument. My reply is as follows.

“No, he said that Mr. Goode’s position was un-American”

Adam Ricketson used an argument to reach the conclusion. He attributed to Goode the idea that religion and state should be conflated, and based on that Ricketson concluded that Goode was un-American. I then held Ricketson to his claim that conflating religion and state is un-American. Since that is done in Islam, Ricketson is bound by Ricketson’s argument to conclude that Islam, for Ricketson, is un-American.

“Your presumption is that all Muslim immigrants are part of that “most” you cited as wanting Sharia? Are they the most likely to be the ones immigrating to America?”

The 19 on 9-11 clearly did. If we can’t tell, they can’t come. That is in our interest. They don’t have a right to come here.

“And what? By God we will bomb them outta that wish?”

If they can’t come here, they can’t come here and kill us, as they did between WTC 93 and WTC and Pentagon 2001. All the 19 immigrants came in after the WTC 93 attack. Republicans were attacked as bigots for wanting to stop immigration then. Peter Jennings and the MSM realized that on 9-11, realized his guilt, and then pre-emptively attacked restrictionists as bigots to cover up his own guilt. Norman Mineta did the same the next day on profiling. We now know he had warnings before 9-11 that were specific. His reason not to put in profiling on 9-12 was part of the coverup of those warnings. See Complete 9-11 Timeline, which is trying to raise money for a matching grant.

” As long as America holds to its Constitution, no religion will be able to dictate to America…”

The question at issue is how to keep Islam in particular from so dictating. Goode proposes stopping Muslim immigration, which is a sufficient condition, assuming low conversion rates.

“unless we weaken it by blurring the borders with 10 Commandments in courthouses.” The problem is blurring our physical borders by immigration.

I appreciate your personal history in Turkey and taking time to look at my site.

“Turkey is a secular democratic Muslim country that has looked towards Europe and found that Western Europe will never accept them until they “Become Western”.”

They killed a priest after the Pope’s remarks. They have restrictions on Churches. There is still violence against Christians.

“helped us in the first Gulf war.” But not the second.

Also it was the secular Young Turks in control in 1914 who killed over 1 million Christians. That was the secular government. At the same time they helped us in Korea, they also had more violence and discrimination against Christians.

Thank you for your thoughtful comments,

Old Atlantic

Posted by: Old Atlantic
Date: December 21, 2006 09:03 AM

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002206.php#comments

==

“However, my understanding of history is that invading Muslim armies were remarkably tolerant on “infidels” living in their midst.”

Sometimes. The problem is if they eventually get around to genocide, or forcing out, then its not so good. Also the second class status is not so good anyhow. Do we want to be second class in our own country? Isn’t that a reason to stop Muslim immigration? Goode says let’s not be second class to Muslims in America and people call him a bigot for that?

“However, my understanding of history is that invading Muslim armies were remarkably tolerant on “infidels” living in their midst.”

At times they were. But at other times, not. Once they took over, over time, second class status wore people down. There are no longer many Christians in most Muslim countries. Where did they go? They either converted, left or died out. Genocide doesn’t have to happen fast. Most ones are slow.

“If this widespread genocidal tendency of Muslims is true, would there be Spaniards, Greeks, or Serbs today?”

There are few Christians left in Muslim countries today, such as Turkey which had a large Christian population in 1914, see link attached to my name.

The groups you mention refought and reclaimed their lands with help. In Turkey the Christians were genocided by secular Turks. Bethlehem was 85 percent Christian in 1948 and is 12 percent today. Constantinople was over 50 percent Christian in 1914.

Also a group can be subjected to genocide and still have people alive today. Jews were genocided in WWII, but there are still Jews.

” How about Indians in India?” There has been extensive genocide by Muslims against Hindus and others in India.

Tamerlane’s attack on Delhi is an example. There are projections or claims of as high as 70 million.

http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/9391.html

==

http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/014506.php

The depth of their attack is because Goode told the truth.

After WTC 93 attack they should have stopped immigration. Buchanan said to and they called him a racist bigot. The 19 hijackers came in “legally” after WTC 93. The MSM, Democrats, even Republicans had to lie on 9-11 and call restrictionists bigots to cover up their own complicity.

Mineta was covering up the next day. He said no profiling. The truth was he already had specific warnings. On 9-12, Mineta, was covering up the warnings.

Bush gave his religion of peace speech to cover up the August 6, 2001 PDB he got saying “bin Laden determined to attack in the United States”.
Bush had to have a reason to ignore the warning. His reason was that Islam is a religion of peace. That was his cover story for not responding to the warnings.

Bush killed the 3000 people by negligence. If Bush was commander of a ship he would have been court martialed and judged guilty and relieved.
Bush’s face on 9-11 was an, “I should be court martialed look”.

Congress should have impeached him for ignoring those warnings. Bush was covering up and obstructing Congress’s power of impeachment. He still is.

The attack on Virgil Goode, and on Tom Tancredo, etc. are all part of this cover up for the 9-11 guilt.

As much web presence on liberal blogs for this as possible is needed. Putting up basic information in a neutral way will help. What is “obvious” on Jihad Watch is totally unknown to many people.

Just cut and paste snippets with attribution from the many articles is enough to totally turn around and stop the liberal propaganda machine. This is vital. If your local newsaper allows comments, paste there. E-mail your rep or Senator. They are attacking Goode deliberately. They have had him in their sights and been planning this. Its not just spontaneous.

Posted by: Old Atlantic [TypeKey Profile Page] at December 21, 2006 12:51 PM

 

==

 

While sending comments to the Congressmen above, and stay very very polite, also send a copy to one of your Senators or your Congressman. Its better to do one than none.

Senate.gov

You can look up your Senator. Be polite and short and quote a snippet from Jihad Watch that makes them look at it.

House.gov

We want to build mind share with Congress for Jihad Watch. You can’t use html, but just use

http://www.jihadwatch.org.

We were attacked:

WTC 1993

East African embassies August 1998

USS Cole October 2000

WTC and Pentagon 2001.

Not until after the 4th attack did we do anything.

Bin Laden declared war in 1998.


Complete 9-11 Timeline

Can quote from above as well, short with the link as text.


bin Laden’s 1998 Fatwa with bold on quotables

“Nothing is more sacred than belief except repulsing an enemy who is attacking religion and life.” On that basis, and in compliance with Allah’s order, we issue the following fatwa to all Muslims: The ruling to kill the Americans and their allies — civilians and military — is an individual duty for every Muslim who can do it in any country in which it is possible to do it, in order to liberate the al-Aqsa Mosque and the holy mosque [Mecca] from their grip, and in order for their armies to move out of all the lands of Islam, defeated and unable to threaten any Muslim. ”

Posted by: Old Atlantic [TypeKey Profile Page] at December 21, 2006 01:37 PM

 

==

We were attacked, we are at war. Congress is supposed to protect us. That’s in the Constitution. Part of protecting us is stopping immigration by those who already attacked us from the inside. They have to do that, its in the Constitution.

Posted by: Old Atlantic [TypeKey Profile Page] at December 21, 2006 01:40 PM

 

http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/014506.php

==


Oath of Office

Source: Congressional Record (House) – Updated March 10, 2005

OATH OF OFFICE MEMBERS, RESIDENT COMMISSIONER, AND DELEGATES

The oath of office required by the sixth article of the Constitution of the United States, and as provided by section 2 of the act of May 13, 1884 (23 Stat. 22), to be administered to members, Resident Commissioner, and Delegates of the House of Representatives, the text of which is carried in 5 U.S.C. 3331:

“I, AB, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office on which I am about to enter. So help me God.”

has been subscribed to in person and filed in duplicate with the Clerk of the House of Representatives by the following Members of the 109th Congress, pursuant to the provisions of 2 U.S.C. 25

After Pearl Harbor they fulfilled their oath by stopping immigration from Japan and Germany until after World War II was over, and our armies occupied all enemy homelands. They have to stop Muslim immigration until all enemy homelands in the 100 year war the Pentagon has said we are in are occupied or at real peace with us.

Posted by: Old Atlantic [TypeKey Profile Page] at December 21, 2006 01:46 PM

 

==

Christmas jihad

http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/014508.php

 

This is why there shouldn’t be Muslim immigration. How can they predict in advance Muslim terrorist attacks? Isn’t that “racist”?

This is why they attack Virgil Goode, he tells the truth. When they say Muslims will attack us, they should stop their immigration. They can’t have it both ways. If its predictable in advance, they should stop the immigration.
Posted by: Old Atlantic [TypeKey Profile Page] at December 21, 2006 12:45 PM

Troops dying Iraq in Afghanistan is in vain unless we win the war of hearts and minds at home. It may be your loved one who is saved from a future attack. There were sleeper cells from the 1980’s.

See
Complete 9-11 Timeline

Sleeper cells are entering the country legally now.

We need a web presence on liberal blog sites. Just quote snips with attribution from Jihad Watch articles in a neutral fact way. Turn the other cheek when they call you racist and just feed back facts.

Say Virgil Goode speaks for me. Virgil Goode stands up for me and I stand up for Virgil Goode. I join Virgil Goode in saying stop all Muslim immigration now.

They will go crazy, and that’s your opening to feed in facts in a neutral way. They also serve who fight the blog wars.

Posted by: Old Atlantic [TypeKey Profile Page] at December 21, 2006 12:57 PM

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

==

Oath for Senators


Oath of Office


History

oath site:senate.gov


Oath info at Wiki

Posted by: Old Atlantic [TypeKey Profile Page] at December 21, 2006 01:59 PM

 

http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/014506.php

 

==

Preamble Constitution

Preamble
“We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.”
Posted by: Old Atlantic [TypeKey Profile Page] at December 21, 2006 02:03 PM

http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/014506.php

==

When the government predicts another terrorist attack and doesn’t stop Muslim immigration its violating the preamble of the Constitution.

==Paul Begala calls Virgil Goode a bigot.

People die so that Begala can get Democrats elected, or so Begala thinks. Americans shouldn’t die so that the Democratic Party can elect its candidates. The consequence of Muslim immigration is that Americas die. The government says that itself. Saving American lives is not bigotry.

Begala is trading American lives for what he believes will get them votes. Begala deserves neither votes nor to be called anything but tragically mistaken in time of war.

==

barbara.swisher | Dec 21, 2006 5:25:01 PM is right.
quote Stanley_98. Youve got it right mate! end quote

By greenhead | Dec 21, 2006 5:43:58 PM is right. After Pearl Harbor we stopped immigration. We were attacked at WTC by immigrants in 1993 and again in 2001. We should stop immigration until the war is over, just as we did after Pearl Harbor. We didn’t have immigration from Russia during the Cold War. This is no different.

WaPo Comments

==

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002215.php

David Asman: So you do believe there’re too many Middle Easterners here now?(brief pause)

Rep. Virgil Goode: No, I — I said there — and the Diversity Visa program needs to be ended. It shouldn’t have been adopted to begin with, in my opinion.

Asman: But do you think there are too many Middle Easterners in the United States right now?

(brief pause)

Goode: Uh — I’m not gonna say ‘yes’ or ‘no’ on that. I’d like to know the exact number. I don’t have the exact numbers.

Each person is limited to how far they can state the truth beyond the PC boundary. It falls off like the tail of the Gaussian distribution.

Goode has gone well over his limit of truth telling, which is why the PC-pecking hunters are after him.

PC: a method by which all liberals keep all people in a state of fear. (modified from Firing Line debate)

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002215.php

==

Actually it falls off like a modified Bessel function, the MacDonald Function, but that’s being technical.

==

Is it moral to instead of bombing people in Iraq to instead deny the same people immigration to the US? If we catch them there we can kill them, but if they make it here they can get in? Is that superior morality to not letting them in here but not bombing there?

Lest it be said this is an absurd question, Bush, our “Religion of Peace” President, has said that we have to fight them there so we don’t have to fight them here. So its a fair question, is it right to stop immigration here so as to reduce our need to kill them there? Or is it morally wrong to do anything that reduces the pressure on us to kill them there?

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002206.php

==

The above point shows that morality may be trickier during time of war than the time it takes to cry bigot, let loose the dogs of PC war.

==

Should an entire airbase in the US with bombers with nuclear weapons be turned over to immigrants from the Middle East?

If the answer is no, are you a bigot?

Even if they swear an oath on the Koran?

==

Why is it moral to let people come here and kill people here in 1993 and then let more people come here and kill people here in 2001? Isn’t this the Mineta Bush defense?

After 9-11, Mineta said no profiling is moral. Bush agrees. Then we learn Bush had a PDB warning him, “bin Laden determined to attack in the United States.”

Why is it moral for Bush to call those who wanted to stop immigration in 1996 before the 19 hijackers came here legally bigot or Begala? Begala’s Clinton is the one who let them in after WTC 1993 attack? Why can Begala call the victims of his mistake in the 1990’s bigots, but he is a good person to have ignored the attack on the US in 1993 at the WTC?

Why is it right to let people attack WTC in 1993 and do nothing and respond in 2001 to the same people by invading 2 countries? Which is right?

Isn’t the bigot word used to avoid answering this question? Isn’t this just part of the 9-11 coverup, the use of this word bigot?

Aren’t we hearing the samething we heard from Peter Jennings, Mineta and Bush on 9-11, that the people who said stop immigration after WTC 1993 were bigots?

All 3 of them knew more than the average Joe about the threat. None of them warned the average Joe. Why?

Why does Begala threaten to call anyone, including the families of 9-11, bigots for saying no immigration after WTC 93, WTC and Pentagon 2001 ?

Some 9-11 families have called for ending or limiting immigration especially of Muslims. Why doesn’t Begala call them bigots?

Why is it right for Cindy Sheehan to go to Venzuela to call Bush names for her son, but wrong for the 9-11 families to stay in America and say no more immigration?

Why is it right to complain after your family members are killed but not before? How do you complain for yourself? Do you tape a message saying stop immigration, play this after I’m dead? Would that be bigoted because you thought you might be killed by Muslims?

Why are we told that Muslims are going to attack us from within again?

Why do we have immigration from Pakistan which teaches hate of Americans? Same for Saudi Arabia? They teach hate in their elementary schools? Its homework? Should they be let in? Given control over nuclear equiped bombers?

Is it bigotry to keep them from controlling our bombers?

Is it bigotry to deny security clearances to people with families in China or Pakistan? They do it now. Why no cries that this is bigotry?

Why no cry of bigotry when immigrants kill Americans?

Why no cry of bigotry when immigrants give night vision or stealth secrets to China?

Why isn’t it bigotry when American soldiers are killed or maimed by American night vision given to China by Chinese grad students or H-1B’s? Why isn’t that bigotry?

==

Which is morally superior, to ignore a PDB on your desk on August 6, 2001 saying bin Laden determined to attack in the United States, do nothing, let him attack, then praise Islam as the Religion of Peace, then cover up the role of Saudi Arabia and Pakistan not publish the 28 pages in 2003 from the Congressional inquiry linking Saudi Arabia to the financing of 9-11, have a commission the families said was a whitewash, and invade another country Iraq or to say what Goode said?

According to Begala, Goode is beyond the pale, stop Muslim immigration, but what Bush, Norman Mineta, Clinton, Democrats and Republicans did is all fine.

Why is Goode a bigot? But torture is ok as long as you have Korans at Gitmo and don’t flush them down the toilet?

Why is paying off Russia in the 1990’s ok, and concealing it from the USAO Mass, and then letting Pakistan and India do their nuke tests, and all the rest ok? Why is Clinton raping a woman ok? Why is Goode wrong but Clinton right? Why does Begala call Goode a bigot for saying stop Muslim immigration, but calls Clinton friend after a woman comes forward about his raping them while State Attorney General of Arkansas?

If you are in the Club that’s what matters. Goode isn’t in the clubs. Neither were the people in WTC or the Pentagon who couldn’t make it out. Neither are our troops in Iraq and Afghanistan. Who is killing them and why? Does Begala know?

==What isn’t called bigotry:

  1. Letting in the 19 hijackers after WTC 1993 attack, and other warnings.
  2. Not going on a war footing after the WTC 1993 attack.
  3. Not responding to the August 6, 2001 briefing, bin Laden determined to attack in the US.
  4. Chinese immigrants who give US night vision to China.
  5. Indian immigrant who gives US stealth to China.
  6. Foreign profs who don’t give good letters of recommendation to American undergrads for Ph.D. programs but instead admit students of their former profs in their home country.
  7. Later when those same students contribute to giving our secrets or know-how to China.
  8. Letting our night vision end up in the hands of insurgents who use it to kill and maim our troops.
  9. Doing the above in time of war.
  10. Doing the above 13 years after the WTC 1993 attack.
  11. Doing the above 27 years after the 1979 hostage taking in Iran.
  12. Letting Pakistan get nuclear weapons.
  13. Covering up the involvement of Saudi Arabia in financing the Taliban, before, during and after 9-11.
  14. Covering up the involvement of Pakistan in supporting the Taliban, before, during, and after 9-11.
  15. Calling bigot those who wanted to stop immigration when you had classified information all during the Clinton administration in the 1990’s about Muslim plots to kill Americans.
  16. Calling bigot the victims of 9-11 or their families.
  17. Issuing warnings of terrorist attacks by Muslims and calling those who want to stop the immigration of the same people, bigot.
  18. Calling the victims of Muslims engaged in genocide of Christians in Lebanon and Bethlehem bigots for pointing out how its rooted in the Koran.
  19. Concealing that the Armenian genocide was done by Muslims against Christians from those who don’t realize that.
  20. Lying or covering up decisions of Saudi judges that they say is based on the Koran or Islam.
  21. The same for Pakistan, Afghanistan, Somalia, Sudan, Nigeria, Iraq, etc.
  22. Concealing polls from the general public that show non-PC conforming results by Muslims in foreign lands or in the country of immigration.
  23. Not showing Danish Cartoons.
  24. Asking for ritualistic Stalinist Maoist Leftist Orwellian denunciations of people you agree with.
  25. Being put on the spot, after your guy is called a bigot by Begala, of either saying he is a bigot, or losing your career, and having people hang out around your house or school perhaps.
  26. Pretending that there are not Danish Cartoonists in hiding.
  27. Asking Bay Buchanan to denounce Goode as a bigot when CNN was afraid to show the Danish Cartoons for fear of violence against CNN people by Muslims around the world.
  28. Asking people to denounce people on their side, when they know that Danish Cartoonists, French school teachers, politicians, moderate Muslims, Rushdie, authors, etc. are in hiding under death threats for saying the same things as Virgil Goode said.
  29. Pretending that people who denounce Goode while Danish Cartoonists are under death threat are doing so under their own free will.
  30. Pretending that its ok to ask someone to say Goode is a bigot on CNN while there are people in hiding for denouncing Islam or Muhammed.
  31. Pretending that its ok to call Goode a bigot while others are in hiding for saying bad things about Islam.
  32. Talking about Goode’s statement on CNN without saying that CNN was afraid to publish the Cartoons and still doesn’t have them on their website because they have correspondents in Muslim countries who they don’t want killed.
  33. Talking about Goode’s statement on CNN and not admitting that CNN might lose all its offices in every Muslim country if it put the Danish Cartoons on its website.
  34. Making Bay Buchanan denounce Goode while this is going on and pretending its friendly chatter.
  35. Pretending that putting Bay Buchanan in the position of defending Goode was not something that CNN was afraid to do for the Danish Cartoonists and our freedom.
  36. Calling those who have the courage to criticize Islam or Muhammed or call for stopping Muslim immigration when CNN, the New York Times, Washington Post, MSM, etc. were afraid to publish the Cartoons.
  37. Selling out Western Civilization because they are afraid of Muslim violence and have shown it by not publishing the Cartoons.
  38. Being afraid to say the Danish Cartoonists had the right to mock Muhammed and Islam while they were receiving death threats.

==

Thank you Vashine for telling us this. History is made by one person at a time, or two or three at a time. One person can make a difference.

One witness to the truth can change the world, if they have the courage to speak up, and the ability to repeat it endlessly even though nothing seems to happen, no one thanks you, and you never see anything come of it.

Thank you Vashine.

Thank you Virgil Goode.

Thank you Hugh, Robert and fellow posters.

Posted by: Old Atlantic [TypeKey Profile Page] at December 21, 2006 09:06 PM

 

http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/014506.php

 

==

“just said NO”

Just say no to Iran having Nukes.

Just say no to Pakistan keeping nukes.

Just say no to Pakistan putting nukes on missiles on subs off our shores.

Just say no to A Q Khan’s getting their Ph.D.’s in Belgium and taking the secrets of nukes back.

Just say no to not publishing the 28 pages of the Congressional report on Saudi Arabia’s links to financing al Qaeda and 9-11.

Just say no to keeping Pakistan’s role in terrorirsm hidden.

Just say no to PC.

Just say no to Muslim immigration.

Just say no to Islam.

Just say yes to truth.

Thank you Caroline for this phrase and thought.

Posted by: Old Atlantic [TypeKey Profile Page] at December 21, 2006 09:33 PM

 

http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/014506.php

 

Islam is an idea, and you can criticize an idea. That’s in the Constitution. Its in John Locke. Its in Magna Carta. Its in the Bible, just look under truth. Just look under free. You know what free is, don’t you Begala?

I have a dream that one day we shall be free of Islam and the fear of Islam. One day Danish Cartoonists will come out of hiding, join hand in hand with Arab Christians and former Muslims and sing, Free at Last, Free at Last, Thank God Almighty, Free at Last.

 

==

Now that you bring up diversity, Robert Putnam of Harvard has done a study of diversity. Diversity reduces trust not just between groups but even within groups.

Men’s median wages are lower than they were in 1973 due to the 1965 Immigration Act. That might have something to do with it too.

Black men’s labor participation rate has fallen from 1960 to 2006 and prison incarceration rates gone up dramatically. See Steve Sailer at Vdare for that and Borjas of Harvard.

Maybe even 9-11 and all the coverups and shouting bigot after each terrorist incident instead of stopping immigration also pushes trust down.

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002215.php

==

Amendment I – Freedom of Religion, Press, Expression. Ratified 12/15/1791.

From wiki Caliphate

quote

The Caliphate (Arabic خلافة Khilafah) is an Islamic federal government which represents political leadership and unity of the Muslim world (Ummah) applying Islamic law (Shariah). The Caliph is the term for the head of state and it is the only form of government sanctioned in traditional Islamic theology.

end quote

The US first Amendment violates Islam. Islam has the unification of religion and state.

Muhammed and the Caliphs were head of religion and head of state in one person.

The Koran was written in 656 AD during the Caliphate and under its direction.

From wiki on Qu’ran

quote

When at the Battle of Yamama in 633 AD a number of Muslims were killed it was feared that part of the revelations might be lost. Therefore, Abu Bakr, the first Muslim leader after Muhammad’s death, asked Zaid ibn Thabit to collect all the different writing materials on which the Quran was written down.

end quote

This may be too subtle to notice what this implies. 633 AD is when Islam as a unified state and religion single entity attacked the Eastern Roman Empire, the Western superpower, which was Christian and Jewish. The reason they had to write down the Koran was because by attacking the West they were losing their own men in battle. So they had to write down the Koran between conquests.

It was finished in 656 AD while they were occupying provinces of the Eastern Roman Empire they had conquered. The Caliphs made sure the Koran commanded Muslims to do everything they had done from the attack on the Eastern Roman Empire and to Christians and Jews, everything they were doing and everything they might want to do.

After they wrote it they went back to conquering more provinces of the Roman Empire, and killing and genociding Christians, Jews, Hindus and others. That has continued to the present day. They wrote it in 656 AD to command Muslims to do all those things. That was the intended use because they were in occupation and wanted to keep conquering, which they did. The people doing the conquering were in control of the writing of the Koran.

That covers everything up to and after 9-11.

The security code for this entry is fear, how appropriate. Islam if used as intended by Muslims is supposed to create fear in all non-Muslims everywhere.

==

“Wow.

I had no idea.”

Because MSM doesn’t tell you the truth about immigration any more than Islam. See Jihad Watch for the latter, and Lou Dobbs and Vdare for the former.

“Those are the usual explanations offered for the failure of real wages to keep up, or the increase in incarceration rates for black men.”

Borjas has done a study on precisely the impact of immigration on economic opportunity of Black men and precisely on their incarceration rates. You can go to his webpage at Harvard and download it.

“Immigration and African-American Employment Opportunities: The Response of Wages, Employment, and Incarceration to Labor Supply Shocks” September 2006.

You probably didn’t hear of this Harvard study, praised by Greg Mankiw (you know who he is right?) on Mankiw’s blog.

The link by my name has links to Borjas and to Vdare. Search Vdare Borjas for a layman’s guide.
Posted by: Old Atlantic

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002215.php#comments

 

 

 

 

==

“Immigration and African-American Employment Opportunities: The Response of Wages, Employment, and Incarceration to Labor Supply Shocks” September 2006.
from George J. Borjas, Jeffrey Grogger, Gordon H. Hanson

“The employment rate of black men, and particularly of low-skill black men, fell precipitously from 1960 to 2000. At the same time, the incarceration rate of black men rose markedly. This paper examines the relation between immigration and these trends in black employment and incarceration. Using data drawn from the 1960-2000 U.S. Censuses, we find a strong correlation between immigration, black wages, black employment rates, and black incarceration rates. As immigrants disproportionately increased the supply of workers in a particular skill group, the wage of black workers in that group fell, the employment rate declined, and the incarceration rate rose. Our analysis suggests that a 10-percent immigrant-induced increase in the supply of a particular skill group reduced the black wage by 3.6 percent, lowered the employment rate of black men by 2.4 percentage points, and increased the incarceration rate of blacks by almost a full percentage point.”

See link on my name for link to source.

The security code is nose, again how appropriate.

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002215.php

==

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002215.php

Back to the Koran and oath taking. The Koran was written down because on a battlefield in 633 AD, a battle of Islam as a single political-military-religious entity’s choice, some of its soldiers died, and they had bits of Muhammed’s sayings memorized.

So they started writing them down. By 656 AD they had a version. By that time they had conquered provinces of the Eastern Roman Empire and were occupying them.

So they got it from people off the battlefield from 633 AD. That makes it a battle field manual. The Koran is the battle field manual of the attack on the Christian and Jewish Eastern Roman Empire, the Western Superpower, from 633 AD onwards.

So taking the oath on the Koran is like taking an oath during WWII on the German Army’s Battle Field Manual, in German. A Congressman who wanted to do that in 1944, or even 1947, would not have been allowed to take his seat.

The Koran is the battle field manual of the attack of the single unitary religious-military-political entity Islam on the Western superpower from a battlefield of the war in 633 AD on the Western Superpower.

We are the Western Superpower. So the Koran is the battle field manual of the war on us. That war has had as recent battles, the 1979 embassy attack in Iran, the 1993 WTC attack, the 1998 embassy attacks, the 2000 Cole attack, the 9-11 WTC and Pentagon attacks. Note that 2 of those attacks were on embassies.

Our Congressmen should not take an oath of the battle field manual of what is attacking us. Its what attacked us in 633 AD, the Christian Jewish Western Superpower, and on 9-11 2001 AD, the Christian Jewish Western Superpower. That’s us.

And if you want to include Hindus and anyone else, Islam’s been attacking them too.

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002215.php

==

Caroline, good points on Jihad Watch’s contribution to the education of Lawrence Auster. Robert Spencer runs Jihad Watch on the self-discovery method. He tries to hold back on forcing conclusions on us, and just lets us debate in the seminar room.

The result is we come to the conclusions that Hugh, Auster, Vashine, Virgil Goode, etc. come to.

As you and Foehammer point out, Virgil Goode is the Puritan soul to lead us out of the Inferno after a dose of Common Sense at Jihad Watch.

Posted by: Old Atlantic [TypeKey Profile Page] at December 22, 2006 12:22 AM

 

http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/014506.php

 

==

“Men’s median wages are lower than they were in 1973 due to the 1965 Immigration Act. … Black men’s labor participation rate has fallen from 1960 to 2006 and prison incarceration rates gone up dramatically.”

All because of immigration? You mean it doesn’t have anything to do with inflation, or budget deficits,

Inflation as a cause of median wage changes (after adjusting for inflation) over a 30+ time interval is not causal for any economic theory I am aware of. Nor for labor force participation rate of a segment like Black men.

Some of your other variables can have a causal role, of course.

My security code word is rate, which seems appropriate for this note.

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/002215.php

==

 

Good points. Being against Muslim immigration is a position to be debated, not one excluded without discussion.

PC Police like Saudi Religious Police say that the conclusion must be agreed to first, (without discussion) and the debate held afterwards, if its allowed, which in this case its not.

==

BTW the Founding Fathers would never permit Muslim immigration while Americans were held as slaves and being crucified. This was actually the case, the Barbary Pirates, actually foreign Muslim governments, were doing just that.

They also wouldn’t have allowed a Muslim to be a member of Congress and take an oath on the Koran while Americans were being snatched off the high seas to be slaves in the name of Islam’s war on the West and Christianity, which they were c. 1800.

1800 Christian Americans taken hostage and made slaves in North Africa.

c. 1900 Ditto.

2001. Americans, Christians and Jews killed on 9-11 at WTC (2nd try by new group of Muslim immigrants from after WTC 93 first try) and Pentagon (First Try).

Projection by 2100: tens of millions of Americans killed by Muslim nuclear weapons, they called it the Muslim bomb themselves in Pakistan as one Hindu reader pointed out at Jihad Watch I think. Europe under Sharia law. America occupied and under Sharia law after it surrenders to the Iran, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia sub flotilla armed with nukes on missiles.

Why would we surrender? Isn’t that what we are debating now? A country that acts like America has convinced the Muslim countries it will surrender. Immigration convinces them they are winning and we won’t fight for Christianity, Atheism, Judaism or Hinduism. They say all the time, we convince them we are surrender material.

So they think they can launch nukes from their subs and we will give up without a fight. Why would we do anything that could lead to our deaths, when we could just surrender? Immigration is surrender. So they think it means surrender to a nuclear attack by them.

They don’t see mutual assured destruction, they see multiculturally assured dhimmis.

We have let Iran, Pakistan, and Saudi Arabia get away with anything they wanted, even attacking us and we’ve always surrendered meekly.  After 9-11, we’ve covered up for Saudi Arabia and Pakistan and given them airlifts out of America and Kunduz respectively, after they were linked to fighting us here and there.  We are Dhimmi cowards and surrenderers.  They can nuke us and we won’t do anything.  We’ve proven it over and over.

We are going to talk ourselves into being nuked by attacking Goode and letting Keith Ellison take the oath on the Koran.  Americans are going to die because of that.   They will attack us because they think its a form of surrender.  The attacks on Goode make that worse.

That’s how they think.  Bin Laden said it in his fatwa or elsewhere.  They think we are Dhimmi Surrender Cowards.  The President of Iran says that all the time.   That’s all we show to them.

We don’t stand up for Danish Cartoonists, for Goode, for Christianity, for Judaism, for anything we say we believe in.  We set up Islamic Republics in Iraq and Afghanistan, i.e. we surrendered.  Bush’s religion of peace speech was a surrender speech. We are contemptible to them.

Immigration is surrender to them. Qaddafi said so.

==
This post is speculation, hypotheses or opinion. All other disclaimers apply.

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